NHS

Cant understand nhs asking people do they want to be kept on the waiting list for operations.people dont want to be kept on a waiting list they want t.o be seen..Do they want everybody to go Private.People who have worked all there lives have paid for there care only a differant way.the person who sends these texts i wonder if any is to her own famly.My wife been waiting above 2 years.She has been sent 2 texts askiinking does she stil want to be on the waiting list.those who send these texts are in cuckoo land.

albion

Maybe it is just a 'quick' way of asking if a person's circumstances have changed, is everything still the same, as in are you still living in the area, is the person in question still alive, have things moved on and other medical conditions have overtaken the condition which is requiring an operation, maybe some folk just don't want the operation, and you might think that the NHS has access to all this sort of information at the touch of a button, but they don't, they would have to make inquiries, so it is just easier to send a text to the patients asking them.

The NHS are now sending a text and even a email to remind people about an appointment due to the number of people not turning up for an appointment and making it harder for those wanting an appointment for which they would attend.

Those who do not inform the NHS that they will not be attending should be fined for wasting valuable time and money!

the NHS has been deliberately overloaded by this tory government who care not about people who are in pain . they want to have a private system this is why they wont talk to the nhs workers out on strike . your ok if you have plenty money & can afford private health care of which there,s been an upsurge in recent months . if you lose it you will rue there,s no doubt about that .

You are depriving someone else of an appointment, if you don't tell them that you are not attending the appointment, because if you cancel the appointment, then they can give your slot to someone else

Bloomin Eck ,I agree with you OC

that maybe so but the appointments are far & few between meantime people are suffering . does this government care , NO is the answer to that .

The doctors in Scotland have agreed terms. The strike is over there. They won’t settle with the UK government on the same terms because they don’t like the Tories.

Meanwhile,

Recruitment

As for my own position i have been waiting over 2 years to date for Injection's via X-RAY method in my lower spine area ,for at time of writing this my walking is limited to around 40=69 yards then i have to stop and find a place to sit and gather myself , as for the "Waiting Time" On my last visit to Preston Royal Hospital ,The Pain Specialist who told me it's a must for me to have these injections then said alas ,"Your case will have to go before an "Ethics" Panel to give the green light to have them done . Still waiting and in the mean-time in excruciating pain , i suppose there are people worse than me ,but i do not and will not blame the NHS or Doctor's or Nurse's for they do an absolutely briiliant job .it's a damn shame the Gov do not recognise that . G.B.

GB

I see a former neurosurgeon from Preston hospital for hydrocortisone injections. He is a very highly regarded neurosurgeon.
Professor Davis is based at the Greater Lancashire Hospital just off the M6 at Preston. Although private his fee is about a third of what most consultants charge. A gentleman.
He was recommended to me by the late John Stanley the pioneering hand and wrist surgeon from
Wrightington hospital.

Interesting reading gaffer but an absolute pack of lies. The amount of doctors leaving the NHS far outweighs the number being recruited!

Rio


The figures first hand from the General Medical Council workforce report.

Workforce report

GAFFER/
I notice you say you saw this particular Gent A Prof Davis , may i inquire has to your visit was it for you? Also if it were, was it sucessful your injections??As i am very keen to learn about him , and am considering the possibility of trying to go and get an appointment with him with a view to him giving me advice and possible injections. Have you any details of him as to how could contact him ,be it thro my own GP or other i would be obliged if you can send me some info ,yours G.B.

GB

I’ll send you an email via Ron in admin.

Gaffer, you honestly believe that? It's like when they say average wage is 35k but include millionaire chairmen to offset thousands of minimum wage earners!

not only do they not like the torys but the pay rise they suggested too . funny they can always find the money for their cronies .

Rio

The chair of Wigan, Wrightington and Leigh NHS, and all similar hospitals,is remunerated on a salary scale of £41,100 to £50,000. Non executive directors get £13,000 per annum.
A salary of £35,000 attracts an employer pension contribution of £7,000 giving an effective salary of £42,000.

June of last year I had an appointment with the Urology Dept at Leigh. In July of this year I had a Pre-op (used to be your operation within 6 wks of pre-op) probably will have to have another before I have my procedure I am one of 7.4 million people on the waiting game

Gaffer your the number one person pushing how great the tory party has done for the People of wigan...... Now your telling people to use private heath care

The reason i go on about what happens over in Israel is because what is being proposed in the uk when it comes to heath care workers from over seas we do it.... And it does not work!!! We have here indies and Philippines here and the problem is they don't go back home because they have a better life here... So how is that going to fix the immigration?? Your also using workers from country's who need there own workers to pull them self out off poverty..... It seems like the Uk is trying to do everything on the cheap.... And i will tell you one more thing some people with government contracts made a lot of money bringing workers over to Israel ..... The only way your going to fix the problem in the uk is with free training with a 10 year contract in the NHS and bringing back the full pension...

I did not read in what gaffer posted about were the UK Gov is going to build more schools, houses, ETC, for these new workers???

and 40 new hospitals dont forget that lie too . the reason being peter israel is because gaffer is a rank tory & like every "dyed in the wool" tory he wants rid of our NHS . it,s very well known that this tory government has run down the NHS & introduced private companies on the NHS board , funny he never mentions that either ? .

Thank you very much for doing that Gaffer .
I will tell you when i get it !
G.B.

Peter Israel

"Gaffer your the number one person pushing how great the tory party has done for the People of wigan......"

I don't agree, Gaffer as always come across has being impartial, he just sticks to the facts

GB

Apparently Ron doesn’t have your email address. Can you please let him know. ron@wiganworld.co.uk

Peter Israel

When I read GBs post number 6345 I decided I would try to help him to end the agony of the severe pain he has endured for over 2 years with no end in sight. I am aware that not all procedures are readily available on the NHS and that sometimes the only relief comes from using the private sector.
I don’t know how GB is fixed financially with regard to the procedure he needs. If it’s not affordable I’ll start a go fund me page on his behalf on social media.
I could like many have read the post and moved on but I’m not from that school.

in your dreams 1stroke that statement is a valid one & has never been impartial where the tory party is concerned . wot makes him right & everyone else wrong ? . dodgy so-called facts arnt all they are supposed to be & a guarenteed back track if he,s wrong trying to prove himself right as iv,e found him out on 3 seperate occasions .

Poppycock !!!!

Posted by: gaffer (7683)
" I am aware that not all procedures are readily available on the NHS and that sometimes the only relief comes from using the private sector."

Oh yes they are available on the NHS, Gaffer. Its just that you have to wait in a queue for your turn. On the other hand, if you use the private sector, and pay for it you are just jumping the queue. A bit like a VIP pass at any event.

really 1stroke . another posting above seems to think the same . it,s the blind leading the blind . typical of you 1stroke .

CC.

From the Guardian five years ago.


NHS wields the axe on 17 'unnecessary procedures'
This article is more than 5 years old
Varicose vein surgery and tonsil removal feature on list of routine operations to be axed
Patrick Greenfield
@pgreenfielduk
Sat 30 Jun 2018 08.43 BST
Hundreds of thousands of NHS patients will be refused operations judged futile as part of cost-cutting measures in the health service.

Procedures including injections for back pain, surgery to help snorers and knee arthroscopies for arthritis form part of an initial list of 17 operations that will be discontinued completely or highly restricted by NHS England as many of these problems get better without treatment.

The health service hopes the measures will save £200m a year by reducing risky or unnecessary procedures. It will tell patients they have a responsibility to the NHS not to request useless treatment.

Varicose vein surgery and tonsil removal also feature on the list of routine operations to be axed as part of NHS England’s drive to cease outdated and ineffective treatments.

Posted by: gaffer (7685)
Varicose vein surgery and tonsil removal also feature on the list of routine operations to be axed as part of NHS England’s drive to cease outdated and ineffective treatments.

Well, if its ineffective, whats the point of paying private for ineffective treatment when many of those problems get better without treatment.!

and the private sector isnt as good as our NHS hospitals because if owt goes wrong they palm them of to us ? .

Whups

How silly can you get in the spirit of around the twilight hour!

Only hope you are never in need of urgent treatment and the only availability provided to you by the NHS is at a Private Clinic or Hospital

It doe's not matter how much money you have we still ALL have to use A&E there is no private A&E So at some point your going to use the NHS ....

stick to the facts todger . and that is a fact just ask those who have lost people in those private hospitals due to insufficient care .

Posted by: Owd Codger
"Only hope you are never in need of urgent treatment and the only availability provided to you by the NHS is at a Private Clinic or Hospital"

Are you for real?
If the NHS send you to a private hospital at no cost to the patient, that is fine. Its covered by your national contribution costs.
On the other hand, Lord Snooty ( who has money ) will pay to get exactly the same treatment , in exactly the same place, with exactly the same consultant so he can get to the front of the queue!

Its a bit like priority boarding and paying for your seats on an aircraft. Why people pay extra for it I don't know as they will all get on the aircraft and be allocated a seat before it takes off without paying extra!

cheshirecat if the NHS send you to a private hospital at no cost to the patient, Well it does that money is coming from somewhere it not free it out of the nhs budget And your taking away nurse from the NHS to use private i know in Ireland they send people to EU for treatment

no he,s not for real cheshire cat . he knows very little of wot he talks about in any subject .

Yes, I am for real and if you had understood my comments I was only on about private treatment being provided by the private sector to help to ease the backlog of the NHS as a result of the inceasing population and said nothing about people having to pay for treatment.

Anyway, people getting private treatment today has nothing to do with any Lord Snooty getting priority as many ordinary people are doing likewise in getting private treatment if they can afford it while many other ordinary peope get private treatment as a result of being in a private medical company schemes like BUPA which in many cases today is provided by their employers.

Two members of our family are higher paid employees in the NHS and both have told my Wife and I that more urgent help will be needed from the private sector both financially and facilities wise as it can not carry on as a 100% public sector service because it is not coping with the demands of the rising population.

And the situation will be no different, irrespective of what government is in power unless drastic action is taken.

Posted by: Owd Codger
"Anyway, people getting private treatment today has nothing to do with any Lord Snooty getting priority as many ordinary people are doing likewise in getting private treatment if they can afford it"

Its a big IF, in "if they can afford it"
Its a pity you could not understand the point I was making?

If you still cant understand it after reading it again let me know and i'll explain it to you

Gaffer said, " not all procedures are readily available on the NHS " - and he was correct.

Whups said, "the private sector isnt as good as our NHS hospitals because if owt goes wrong they palm them of to us"
But, Whups, there's the private sector and there's 'the' private sector. Most of the private sector doctors operate from NHS hospitals and are NHS employees (doing foreigners on the side). Using 'the' private sector is out of the range of most ordinary folk.

Peter said, "It doe's not matter how much money you have we still ALL have to use A&E there is no private A&E So at some point your going to use the NHS ...."
But, that's not strictly true. As I said above, the private sector operates within the NHS.

Posted by: tonker
"Using 'the' private sector is out of the range of most ordinary folk."

Thanks for pointing that out, Tonker.
That is what I was trying to explain to Owdcodger. But alas, it went over his head!

I am pleased to report that. My recent experience with the NHS has been faultless, parking is always a problem but, the Staff, doctors and nurses are very professional and caring from start to finish , Our NHS is still the best in the world and second to none, You will always hear of mistakes because people like to report bad news and good work goes unnoticed, So whenever you're ill and need help, rest assured that, your best chance is here in England with the NHS,
Bravo to each and everyone who works there,,,

Many Foundation Trust hospitals cater for private patients.
Wrightington hospital has a private wing.

Is it free, Gaffer.
Or, do you have to pay ( if you can afford it) ?

Nothing is free Chesh, if you've worked, then you have paid tax and NI, both put together come to at least 30% of your income, more if you're a top earner, The NHS service is the same as private but, private patients jump the queue, thats the only difference.

Its the freeloading, immigrants who are wrecking the system

No.
Because of its reputation the private wing at Wrightington tends to cater for professional sports people.I suspect they don’t have a problem in paying the bill.

Well explained, Gaffer.
So they can afford to pay to jump the queue.

I think the preferred term is, " we can fast track you to the consultant for a fee"

Chesh., professional sports people, like motorcycle racers, are covered by insurance. So are footballers, rugby players, horse riders etc. all paid through their governing bodies, also privately. Several TT riders have ended up in Liverpool or Wrightington, as private patients, as a result of crashing in the Isle of Man.
Anybody can have their own private insurance if they want.
People complain at having to pay insurance to cover their own health needs, but the same complaining folk, who can't afford it, pay through the nose for their pet dogs to be treated should they need treatment, operations or check-ups!

Years ago, my own mum, then aged 79, had been waiting for a hip replacement for ages. The waiting list was over 12 months long, at least.
A person known to me is an orthopedic surgeon.
I told her about my mum's plight, with her hip, and she suggested I ring a certain collegue of hers to book a 'private' appointment at his clinic in Fairfield Hospital, St.Helens. I did so, paid the appointment fee (wasn't a lot, easily affordable) and the appointment, at Wrightington Hospital, was a couple of days later.
Two weeks later, she was in Wrightington Hospital, having a new hip joint.

soon as there,s any complication they ship them back to nhs hospitals .

You clearly haven't 'got it', have you, whups?

remember colin hendrie who played for blackburn did,nt his wife die thru complications by going for private cosmetic surgery ? . wot did they do when the complications start pack her off to an nhs hospital but to late . do you get that tonker .

tonker

Whatever truth is said, it makes no impression on those who think that all medical treatment should be free and and people should not be allowed to pay for private treatment or pay into a private health insurance scheme or pay into a private medical insurance scheme if they so wish to avoid a long time of waiting on the not coping NHS.

We are living in the democratic UK, not Communist North Korea!

Whups

I asked you a short while ago and I will ask it again, If you needed urgent medical treatment and the NHS offered the treatment to be carried out at a private clinic or hospital at no cost to yourself, will you refuse the treatment?

No doubt, there will be the usual non sensible replies!

Well stop typing non sensible indecipherable garbage, then!

No one is saying don't pay into a private health insurance scheme or don't pay private for your treatment. What I am saying is that people who do so, pay to jump the queue

Is that a simple enough explanation for you?

yes i would until i could go to an nhs hospital which i have done in the past . now i,ll ask you a question you have failed to reply to , how many of those amateur footballers turned out to be in the pro ranks ? .

Whups

Why should I answer to someone whose sporting caperbilty was just throwing darts in a pub?

really i was part of a management team who took every cup in the wigan area at football & got our local side to the semi final in the lancs shield . darts wise i won everything at least 3 times in my local leagues & played for lancashire in the premier league of britian & won everything with them including the british ko cup which included the home countries of wales , n-ireland & scotland . if you get ANYWHERE near that i,ll be staggered . now answer the question .

I played football at both Youth and Open Age level for well known Amateur Clubs, Coached Youth teams when I retired from playing as well as playing Cricket for clubs in both the Bolton and Bolton Association Leagues and also played league Crown Geen Bowls, Snooker and Table Tennis at various times of my life.

But could never get into just standing on one spot and throwing Darts!

Top that!

Cheshire Pussycat

People who go private on the NHS do so to jump the queue

Darts is a strenuous sport. Whups once had to be taken to hospital by ambulance after suffering a banjo-string injury in a very tight game. He had to use the NHS as his professional sportsperson's insurance had run out!

Posted by: Tommy Two Stroke
"People who go private on the NHS do so to jump the queue"

They have to pay to jump the queue though, its not gratis

Woteva

If you pay private, you pay to jump the queue.
If you see a consultant free on the NHS its up to him whether he operates on you in a private hospital, or in the middle of the M61!

You'll still have to wait your turn as Lord Snooty is before you, because he has paid

Yes, that is what happens, and it is enough to make yoo vote communist

I have never gone 'private' cos I have never been able to afford it

it,s because your no good todger . i played at a very high level & that,s something you,ll never top .

Whups

The very high level of what?

of darts . nominated to play for england . wot was you nominated for , fool of the year .

anyrode, back to the topic of NHS,, I've had to wait in Wigan A+E twice this week for a 5 hour period and a 9 hour period, ( I can hear Sledge and wooden legs laffing) and I'm not giving details of what for but. Its a circus, You name gets shouted and, a nurse will take your pulse, blood pressure then, you go back to the waiting room, Then a short time later, your name gets called again and a higher up nurse takes further details and once again you go back to waiting, During your waiting time you meet many others, All on the same merry go round and you can tell the pro A+E visitor, they bring their own picnic, because those vending machines are rip off machines and I've figured a lot of folks go there to. people watch, They mingle in and fain an injury just to boost in 'inlet' figures and at the end of the visit they go out cured, which put the hospital , efficient figures in the high zone, It also creates wealth and jobs for, security and car parking companies, The genuine injured and sick people pay the price in waiting longer because they have't worked out, There is no cure for getting old, nor for feeding vending machines and car parking meters
After having a chat with my mate Arfur, He's putting a plan together for, A+E weekend stays, Mon -Fri or Fri -Mon at a cost of £50 a neet with picnic and drinks inclusive,

once it,s privitised you wont be waiting that long because if you have medical insurance you,ll be seen right away if you dont you wont be seem at all . it,s coming because nobody has any fight left in them .

Whups

And you need to keep off the pop, especially around the twilight hour and get a good nights sleep.

It might help your thinking about things!

“( I can hear Sledge and wooden legs laffing)”

I have said it before Tom, get some therapy…. A paranoia specialist would be a good start.

i dont drink as broady highlighted in previous posts . wots up with you todger do you actually want a privitised system for this country ? .iv,e seen it in the states & believe me you dont want that system here .

NHS America LINK

just hope you dont need any nhs treatment under privitisation ,you wont be taking the piss then

Use private sector more for NHS patients - Labour
Published
19 May
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surgery picture
IMAGE SOURCE,GETTY IMAGES
By Nick Triggle
Health correspondent
The government in England should increase its use of the private sector to tackle the NHS backlog, Labour says.

It said as many as 300,000 patients have missed out on treatment since it called for greater use of private clinics in January 2022.

And the party said it was unjust that the lack of action meant only those who could afford to pay for treatment themselves were being seen on time.

The government said it was delivering by cutting long waits.

However, data published by NHS England last week showed key targets to tackle the backlogs in cancer care and routine treatment had been missed.

Overall, there are now a record 7.3 million people on a hospital waiting list, which is nearly three million higher than it was before the pandemic started.

NHS misses targets to tackle care backlogs
Labour would go private to cut NHS waiting lists
Health minister Will Quince said: "The Conservatives have virtually eliminated waits of over two years, and cut 18-month waits by 91%."

He said Labour politicians were split over use of the private sector in the NHS, adding: "While Labour fight with themselves over how to deliver care, we are cutting waiting lists and delivering for patients."

However, Labour shadow health secretary Wes Streeting said: "It's completely unjust that only those who can afford to pay to go private are being treated on time, while everyone else is left behind.

"Labour would use the spare capacity in the private sector to get patients seen faster.

"If the Conservatives had got their skates on, almost 300,000 patients could have been treated, off the waiting list and back to living their lives to the full. Rishi Sunak's dither and delay is costing patients dear."

'Cross-party consensus'
That figure is based on the fact the independent sector has said it has capacity to do an extra 30% of the work it was doing for the NHS before the pandemic.

So instead of carrying out the 1.8 million treatments it has for the NHS between January 2022 and March 2023, the private sector could have done 2.1 million, Labour said.

It urged the government to get on and publish the conclusions of the elective recovery taskforce that has been looking at how to make better use of the private sector.

The taskforce finished its work in March, but its findings have yet to be published - although election rules meant it could not be released in the weeks leading up to the local elections at the start of May.

Under the arrangements in place, the private sector carries out NHS work at the same rates received by NHS hospitals.

The criticism by Labour is being seen as another sign of the party's renewed interest in getting the private sector more involved in NHS care.

Labour's last two leaders, Jeremy Corbyn and Ed Miliband, focused their election campaigns on protecting the NHS in England from privatisation.

But under the New Labour government of the late 1990s and 2000s, the role of the private sector increased in the health service.

David Hare, chief executive of the Independent Healthcare Providers Network, said he was pleased to see the "cross-party consensus" on the role the private sector could play in the NHS.

"We look forward to publication of the taskforce report," he added.

Related Topics

ask yourself this , who has deliberately run-down the nhs to the point of having over 7 million on the waiting list ? . who is it that wants to bring in the private sector & labour & every other party have to go along with it to bring down the waiting list ? . who is it that now justifies bringing in the private sector ? . come on guys it,s not rocket science as to why the torys have made people in cronic pain which some have gone private to ease their pain . it,s just up the torys street .

Whups

What world are you in, the Tories have not deliberately run down the NHS as it simply is not coping with the ever increasing population as a result of the mass immigration into our country and it is obvious that some drastic action will have to be taken by whatever government is in power to involve the private sector if the NHS is to remain a free medical service dealing with the increasing financial shortfall and medical problems, appointments, treatment etc, etc.



The days of 100% public sector provision of the NHS have gone and it is time that some faced up to the fact or else they might find that in the future they will have to pay for treatment, operations etc like they do in other countries.


Your opinions about the NHS and indeed othe things like the modernisation of the railways remind me of the Luddites who opposed change in the Industrial Revolution!

OC the railways are performing the worst they've ever done, you need to get on the waiting list for that test because the Tories have made such a mess f the bus over the last 13year you,'ll be waiting about 5 years

you are having a laugh & wot planet are you on todger . it,s a FACT that the NHS has deliberately underfunded for the last 13 yrs , all the main contracts have gone to private firms . it,s people like you that want the NHS privitised for the people onf this country which most cannot afford . i hope it comes your way 1st then we,ll see if it,s your be & end all which i,m sure it will be the latter . wot an idiot you really are .

NHS

where have you got this from eh the times or the spectator .you can put on wot you want gaffer but the facts are that it,s been underfunded from the torys being in power & a well known fact they want to privitise it . they introduced private companies to the NHS board & contracts given out are by a country mile are going to the private sector . why you put this crap on here & advocate everything tory is beyond me . wot price do you put on your own life & that of your family gaffer ? .

Whupsy

I think that yoo should apologise to Gaffer, for being rude to him

up yours .

and i think you shud apologise to every miner with the things you have put on here over the years .

Oooooohh

YOO are being rude to me now

"I apologise to the miners for the things I have put on here over the years"

Whups you post reams of nonsense. God only knows why you can’t even check once in a while the official data from the NHS, Hansard in Parliament, the National Institute for clinical and care excellence and others.
When you left the central school, Cansfied, the teachers must have said thank god he’s gone.Perhaps using stronger words.
The information I posted above is from the King’s Fund.

The king’s fund

I've figured out in my recent experience why the A+E are overloaded, .
1. genuine accidents ,
2. care homes not having the right staff so, they send to A+E at the drop of a hat,
3. criminals getting caught, fake a 'condition' so the cops have to take them in, just to buy time and hope to escape,
4, District nurses sending patients in because, they are out of their depth
5. folks can't get a doctor appointment
6. druggies and down and outs seeking methadone and a free coffee and butty,
7. desperate patients in pain from , what ever the reason, no one in their right mind wants to wait in A+E for 12 hours and, that is the wait I've had twice this week,
God help us all,

They're letting immigrants sleep in Bolton Hospital !

Wigan Infirmary cannot cope now. When Yvonne was admitted at the back end of August she got to the hospital about 2-00pm and was put on a trolley bed on a corridor and the NEXT DAY at Approx 7-30pm she was allocated a bed on MAU ward. Things have not improved and wait till the Covid and Flu Bug takes hold then the hospital will be full of ambulances queueing along Wigan Lane to unload their patients. They sent Yvonne home after 17 days and she still cannot stand and is hoisted out of bed and transferred to her chair in the living room using a wheelchair then hoisted into her chair then in an evening hoisted from her chair back to her bed No O/T's coming till the 9th Oct. Letter of complaint sent to PALS for what good it will do. All the hospital wanted to do was free up a bed

Trying to convince Whups of how or why the NHS is not coping with the increasing population is also like trying to convince the Pope that he is not a Catholic!

PeterP

Have you looked for a home care package for your wife under NHS
Continuing Healthcare?

and yours are full of tory based lies . stevie wonder can see wot the torys have done to the NHS over a13 yr period & sustained underfunding coupled with a shortage of nurses , eveyone in the country is on strike or do your true blue glasses not see that . everything you put on here extols the worst government this country has ever had & the failure of the northern link of HS2 is just the tip of the iceberg . anyone who follows you want their head examining . FACT .

Whups you are a strange bloke, you complain about the Tories using the private sector, but the Labour party want the Tories to use even more of the private sector,then you moan about the NHS being over crowded,but you want all the immigrants to be allowed into the UK.

well domin0 if you cant see they are forced to go along with it you never will . there,s 7.7 million on the waiting list so how do you think they got there ? . do you think underfunding & nurse & bed shortage has anything to do with it ? . who in your opinion has caused this chaos in the 1st place . is there anything strange about that ? .

Whups, the population increase of more than 3.5 million in the last 10
years may be a reason, plus the 300 a day immigrants, and no one has forced the Labour party to want more use of the private sector, remember Blair.

Under the last Labour government the waiting list peaked at 4.2 million. It stayed below 4 million with a small increase before Covid struck leading to mass cancellations. The extra backlog created has been exacerbated by continuing strikes in the NHS.


List

Gaffer.
It has nothing whatsoever to do with the Labour government.
Are you forgetting that this shower of liars have been in power since 2010!
So, they have done nothing to bring the waiting list down in all that time. In fact, they increased it!
The first covid lockdown was in 2020. They had 10 years prior to that to at least make an effort to reduce waiting times!

Why you keep bringing Labour into it and also continuously defending this lying shower who are in power, beggars belief

it,s because he,s a dyed in the wool true blue tory & will make any excuse to vilify anything they do . his so called facts are like shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted like the slight fall in hospital appointments . now he,s resorting to the sunak policy in blaming striking doctors & nurses . it shows what kind of character gaffer has got & not a very good one is it resorting to that kind of strategy . notice he mentioned covid but fails to mention the thousands who died needlessly beacuse of johnson & hancock,s failure to act earlier . a true blue if ever thetre was one . why some on here hang on every word he says in beyond me .

CC

Have you looked at the chart. The waiting list was 4.2 million in August 2007.
Covid and strikes accounts for most of the rest of the increase to over. 7 million.
I’m not favouring any party I like to stick to facts.
The chart was to show that the waiting list problems have been several years in the making with the biggest single factor being the surge in population growth.

domin0 stop blaming people coming into the country it,s not that & you fail to mention the people who have left so there,s not as mant as you say . dont keep naming blair to me as i,ll agree with everything you say about him because in my opinion he was,nt labour at all & was tory thru & thru & i was never a supporter of him as iv,e mentioned several times on different blogs .

Whupsy

Have you ever heard of the saying"Don't Shoot The Messenger" because that is all that Gaffer is doing, he is just giving you the facts, he is just being the messenger, and you and that cat are shooting him

The population of the UK in 1997 was 58.32 million. In 2023 it is 67.74 million .Increase in population 9.42 million.
It’s equivalent to the UK absorbing the entire population of Austria, 8.96 million or Switzerland, 8.80 million.
It’s obvious that some UK services are struggling to cope but it’s a miracle that they’re still functioning.

Gaffer whose letting all these immigrants in

Posted by: gaffer
"The population of the UK in 1997 was 58.32 million. In 2023 it is 67.74 million .Increase in population 9.42 million."

Why on earth do you keep harping on about the past?
Its 2023 now, and the lying shower who are in power at the monent have had 13 years to try and turn things round. I'm sad to say, they have failed miserably.
When is the first installment due of the £350,000 per week, and our 40 new hospitals we were promised for our NHS after leaving the European Union?

Cheshire Puss

Were you a party animal, and went yoo to Bolton Pally and Blighty's at Farnworth

No, Tommy.
I went to Pips in Manchester, there was a choice of music to suit everyones ears, in different rooms

Very nice LINK

gaffer is giving you a one sided opinion at best & those facts your on about can be manipulated in his governments way . he,s not always right & idiots like you hang on his every word . he,s only a messenger for the tory party . is that who you support 1stroke ? .

Whupsy

Were yoo a party animal too

Gaffer, if "it’s obvious that some UK services are struggling to cope" why are they treating people from overseas, who have never contributed, before UK nationals?

i did play darts for lancashire at blightys for part of the season but had to pack it in because of the strike .

Not answering my question gaffer

And if they do get in, which Councils of which political party are giving them the most welcome?

ALL councils in the UK are Conservative,

And how many millions has this incompetent government wasted on headline grabbing schemes that their own advisors told them wouldn't work

he,s not likely to colin as it would put a slur on his party . like iv,e said a 1 sided opinion & he says it in the so-called "statistics" he puts on & always in the torys favour .

Gaffer Yvonne had her NHS CHC appraisal last week she was rejected. I am waiting for the paper work then I can appeal

Peterp I know 2 people who applied for continuing care, both were refused. Keep at them

PeterP
Sorry to hear about that, but they reject just about everyone, we tried for that with my father who had vascular dementia, and it is was rejected, but I hope you win your appeal.

Peter, you’re wrong on 2 counts.

Wrong colour.
Wrong religion.

And, before anybody gets on at me asking for an explanation, I’ve already posted what I’ve seen going on in the Bolton area. Just look my past posts up!

Tonker don't forget we are also at least 5-6 generation who where born here not part of the boat people .
TTS Yvonne has Vascular Dementia and HAD the use of only her left hand due to a stroke 12 years ago. Now she cannot use her hand and has also lost the use of her legs. She is either in bed or her chair. We have carers coming in 4 times a day for her personal care and transfer from her bed to her chair and back again every thing else I do for her. She has not been outside since last August except 3 visits to the hospital (emergency ambulances) We also have the district nurse and podiatry every week due to pressure sores on her legs and foot.So what do you need to get CHC

The person I knew who's condition was similar to your wife Peterp, but with the addition of a feeding peg in the stomach, was refused. Their appeal was turned down. All you can do is keep on trying. Best of luck

Yvonne admitted to hospital again on the 20th March heart rate off the scale not breathing proper found out she had an infection on her left lung. Sent home on Friday the 29th took back into hospital on Mon 1st April same problem which had not cleared up and now compounded by not able to swallow even liquids The hospital was like a war zone again yesterday with all areas of A+E full and corridors full. I was talking to a bloke who had slept on the floor for two nights because the wards were full and they had no trolleys/beds available

I am sorry to hear about all that Peter, but going back a few years, Leigh Infirmary was designated to care for older people, but maybe Leigh cannot cope with Yvonne's complex needs.

Looking back a few posts, and Gaffer gives an increase in population as a cause of hospital overcrowding?

Using those figures shows that for every 100 hospital patients in 1997 there are now 114.
That's a 12% increase, not 300%.

Something else is the cause of the demand on the health system.

In the 2 years between June 2021 & June 2023,2.3 million arrived here and 975,00 left, the extra 1.3 million will make a huge difference with the NHS, and most will have paid nothing in.

Admissions

NHS hospital admissions from the Statista bar chart.
It was 11.1 million in 2001 and 17.2 million in 2021, a 55% increase.

You can view the bar chart on Statista, Number of admissions to NHS hospitals in England from 2000/01 to 2022/23

So, to summarise, the large increase in demand of the health system is not proportional with the increase in population.
Other things which are likely causes are - people living longer - less manual work - different diet - environmental influences ....... ?

On top of that, a lot of people seem to take a liking to "seeing t'doctor", whether they need to or not.

Gaffer's Hospital Admissions figures show that in 2001 there were 35% less admissions than in 2021. Population figures show 26% less in 2001 than in 2021.
Again, the figures are not proportional. There must be something in the water!

Cheers TTS I don't know what patients Leigh hospital looks after but Yvonne is only a young pup at 67 years old not some geriatric woman . Wigan hospital is just overwhelmed with patients and even when they get through an assessment there is no where to go for most of them except onto the corridors. Yvonne is lucky she is in a bed in A+E and is on oxygen and various drips but I cannot get to see a doctor to find out why she will or cannot swallow. She was on a liquid morphine which they put in a syringe and tried to give it orally but she would/could not swallow every thing is at this time given by a drip (nil by Mouth) .Every one of the nursing staff are overstretched . I had to chuckle a few times this afternoon ,One woman was refusing to be put in a cubicle and at one stage got off the bed and wanted to be put back on the corridor and another wanted to go on walk about and they had to keep fetching her back but things like this are not in a nurses remit but they have to cope with it

Not being able to swallow can be caused by a stroke. This can lead to aspiration pneumonia.

Tonker Yvonne had a massive stroke in 2012 and it was one of the 1st things they tested for.Up to press they cannot tell me what is causing the problemShe is now taking oxygen through her nose and every so often when I talk to her she replies so she will talk when she wants to. On Saturday I got one word out of her I asked her something and she replied "NO"Her airway seems clear but if they try to give her anything orally she starts choking.

when are you going to see the real reason the NHS is in the state it,s in , THE TORY PARTY who,s hell bent on privitisation & dont care who gets hurt . they have underfunded it since they came into power with the only winners are the private companies that now festoon the system . get real .

Its those who who keep saying the Tory Government is to blame and need to get real.

A friend of my Wife and I works in the administration of the NHS and has told us that whoever is in power, nothing will change as the NHS in its present way of funding is not coping with the fast growing population as a result of immigration and more people not paying NI contributions together with people living longer which brings a incease in medical issues and increased costs of medication, treatment etc.

Those who keep coming out with the same glib comments about the present government being to blame are only showing how of of touch they are with the situation within the NHS, especially after the extra cost of dealing with a pandemic.

In contrast, it would appear that it is posters like Gaffer, tonker, Tommy Two Stroke who seemed to have a understanding of the reality of the NHS situation.

And to think that a new goverment might be elected on the strength of those who cannot face reality of the real causes of the everday problems and have a limited political mindset is alarming!

In this area it has not helped with the closure of the hospitals even if it was a few years ago Billinge and Whelley. Then you have present day Chorley shutting their A+E along with St Helens& Leigh now only dealing with minor injuries this leaves our area with Wigan A+E. Further afield but still close by are Bolton or Whiston or Warrington who are also struggling to cope. On top of all this there are very few NHS Dentists and what few are left all are booked up for years in advance

More waffle OC

absolute garbage from the site idiot . EVERYTHING stops at no-10 so you get real . do you think all this underfunding isnt due to this rotten government if not then you need to get real . wot an idiot .

UK debt £2.6 trillion. Debt interest payment 2024 £78 billion.

Public sector pension liabilities £1.2 trillion.
State pension liabilities £3.8 trillion.

Healthcare spending 2024 £220 billion.
The number of people employed by the NHS has just passed 2 million.

According to whups the NHS is being starved of money by number 10. With debt interest costing more than defence spending and £ 2.6 trillion of debt it’s difficult to see where more money would come from without taking it from other public spending areas.

Boris Johnson promised 40 new hospitals in his "get brexit done" manifesto. He also stated “we send the EU £350 million a week – let's fund our NHS instead”.
So, when are this government going to start funding it?
Its been over 4 years now since we left the EU and the situation regarding immigration and the NHS has got considerably worse

This inept Tory government have messed up the NHS and plenty other things ,I,'ll ask the question that never gets answers ,what have the Tories improved over the last 14 years ?

Posted by: Owd Codger (3041)

...........Those who keep coming out with the same glib comments.......

The same glib comments??........really??

Posted by: Handsomeminer (2712)
"what have the Tories improved over the last 14 years ?"

They have improved the French economy no end by donating millions of taxpayers pounds to France to stop the immigrants boats coming over here.
Has it worked since they got brexit done?

They might as well have just tossed the taxpayers money over Ramsgate / Dover harbour wall for what good its done

French police are being subject to increasing levels of violence when trying to puncture the small boats.

Im sure the armed French police force should be able to cope with the perpetrators?
The British taxpayers are paying them millions of pounds to "puncture"dingys.
I think we are being overcharged for the service that we are receiving
Don't you agree, Gaffer?

CC

There are also British border patrol officers working with the French to stop the boats. The numerous launching places over a very large area makes finding them before they reach the sea difficult. Having spent a lot of time in the area over many years I can understand the difficulty of the task. I have no doubt there would be a lot more small boats arriving in England without the efforts of the French police.
It’s a pity the Blair government identity card was scrapped. It would have a positive effect in stopping the flow of illegal migrants.

Cheshire Puss:

"Has it worked since they got Brexit done?"

Leaving aside immigration, what do you think about Brexit four years on ?

Would you like to go back into the EU ?

Gaffer.
It was the Tory / Lib Dem coalition that scrapped them.
I do agree with you that it could have had an impact in stopping /slowing the flow of illegal migrants.

Tommy.
Its been a shambles since we didn't get brexit done, and subsequently we left the EU. Ive explained my reasons to you before in previous discussions.
And yes, I would go back in to the EU before midnight tonight, if I could

Gaffer: " ...... identity card was scrapped. It would have a positive effect in stopping the flow of illegal migrants."

Cheshirecat: "I do agree with you that it could have had an impact in stopping /slowing the flow of illegal migrants. "


How do you work that one out?
Consider this ......
twenty-odd miles of deep water doesn't stop them
Armed French police can't stop them.
British border force officers can't stop them.
Having no passport doesn't stop them.
The fact that they have no permission to be here doesn't stop them.

And you think they'll say ......

"come on Abdul, we've got us a boat and we're off to England in an hour, are you coming with us"?

"oh., I can't go to England with you lads, I've got no I.D. Card"!

yes gaffer & all that funding is going into the pockets of the private companies that festoon our NHS .

Chesshire Puss:

"And yes, I would go back in to the EU before midnight tonight, if I could"

You are just being 'DAFT'

no they are not & being realistic . wait till those EU price rises go thru the roof & we,ll see wot you say then after selling us down the river .

Handsomeminer

Funny, when I contacted a relative who lives down south who is also a manager in the administration of the NHS, and asked if what our friend had said was correct, she confimed that it was as the funding of the NHS by whatever political party was in power was not enough for the NHS to cope with the ever increasing and ageing population.

It appears that those involved in the running of the NHS know about what action needs to be taken rather than some who come on here!

Are they as daft as you?

It did not take long for the one liner to reply!

you cant see the forest for the trees todger .

Whupsy

Why are you convinced that the Tories want to privatise the NHS, letting American companies take it over, and then they will refuse to treat poor people, only rich people who can pay for their medical treatments will be treated, and free prescriptions will be stopped, and all medicines will be same the silly price which they are in America.

If that is true, then when Labour get into power they will do the same thing, because there are no differences between the Labour and Conservative party policies.