EX DOWNALL GREENERS 19

HERE WE GO NUMBER 19


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150 Photos of North Ashton


133 photos round Ashton

MAP

Hi Malc, where does pat live these days.

Haydock David with Donna her daughter she split wi ste a few years back

Thanks Malc i did not know that, to be honest not seen a lot of people from estate for years, but i know they look on here as they have taken photos off here to put onto downallgreen pride.

It's a good site dav keep it guin pal

was the other to full dav ? .

Thought i would change it Bri before someone complains it's to long.

Not heard anything from "Bert" for a while last post before Xmas last year. He used to let us know how "Janet"( Jouels &Jouells 2) was going on in the USA . She last posted herself over 2 years ago but was having trouble logging on that's how we ended up with Jouells2. We also know she was not in the best of health but was recovering slowly. It was nice to see her a few years ago at the Bowling club even if she did not remember me

Hi peterp, no they have not been on for a while I hope all is ok with them, have not heard from jouells brother ste for some time either, that meeting at bowling club was a good day I really enjoyed that meeting yourself and dougie and many more, perhaps we should do it again.

First two there bambam and Dougie plus two of the last to leave remember, good job I was called away or I would have finished up under the table but I did come back

Yes it was a very good afternoon dougie, I thought I had got wrong place at first there was no one around until you arrived, and bert kindly took me home the worst for wear a few hours later it was a good drink of Guinness in there.

It's nice a good pint of Guinness David it's OK in garswood Hall always feels nice and homely in theer

when was the last time you was in malc ? .

Just before lock down bri

I used go buffs there with mick middlehurst in 80s we got our drinks from club and shared the hut at rear of club with North Ashton Prize Band.

i could think of worse places to be dav than being with the girls band in that shed .

May sound good that Bri but North Ashton Prize Band at that time was mostly Gents.

pity that dav .

Now if it had been Trinity Girls well that would have been LOVELY.

I wonder why they changed the name to Britannia from Railway at bryn I know it's been gone a while now

I've only ever known that pub as the Brittania Malc must have changed name years ago.

they never changed the name malc .

Yes it was railway Inn see it bryn photo s

malc it was the brittania when it was knocked down ? .

I know bri I've seen a photo where it's says Railway above door it's a long time ago they mentioned it on bryn site

it could,nt have been that in bryn malc . our christine had that pub before it shut with then hubby tommy birchall . it was still called the brit when it was bulldozered .

It's early 1900 hundreds bri it's a old photo

i dont know about that malc & iv,e never heard or seen it called the railway ? .

i know it is still the Brittania on 1914 map.

Type in was Brit ever called the railway people on about it there see what you make of it .

malc there,s only you have seen it called the railway . are you sure it,s the same one ? .

Hi bri I seen it it's while back there's someone trying find it again it's an owd photo tho

Hi Malc, can't find a photo but there is a map of bryn on places which states the Railway pub was there in 1901 it was put on by dougie.

I thout had dreamt it

Dag27, this is the map showing the original name of the pub
---Here--

did,nt think they had trains then ? .

I've see a photo where it says Railway Hotel above the door it's been on places Bryn site nice one Dougie and good morning to all

Morning Malc, and a good one it is to if the photo was on places it should still be there perhaps you have seen it elsewhere.

it must have been between 1901 - 1914 malc .

The man that gave me that map plus other things to photocopy by the name of Brian Brown, next time I see him in Ashton I'll ask him about that photo I may have it on file somewhere but I've that many photo's on disks and hard drives I wouldn't know where to look

Cheers Dougie and thanks for looking

The line between St helens and wigan opened 1869

my word malc i bet that fone of yours is red hot .

I cornt owd it bri

Hi David you was right it was Brian Livsley she was laughing about it she said not seen anyone play kerby and all street games for years like we did

Dag 27, best photo I can find is this one, --Here-- as on the other I found as the name Britannia Hotel right at the top facing you, this could have been a name change put on at a later date, as you say you've seen one with the Railway Hotel over the door

Yes Malc we certainly enjoyed ourselves I loved all the games we played, that pic is going back a while dougie nice one.

Google morning all nice one Dougie like I say I've seen the one wi railway Hotel

Morning Malc, Brian has put Kevin & Carl's Rectory Nurseries on photo a day, who would of thought that what they have achieved to date was once an allotment run by Jack Prescott the man from Lilac Ave who was a good friend of your father.

for anyone that may not have seen the video Jimmy 'O' made with Kevin ---Here-- Have a look go full screen and see comments

I know David it's good on pen as we called it back then they've done a great job on it wife works in skoo and they take kids across thi old fish pond still there old jack Prescott had it back then Brian Clarence had it for a short while too ???? bookies was on it too thy don't know thi next door nabour now How's Mrs Lewis doing

She's doing fine thanks Malc I remember Brian & Doreen, they moved off estate to spindle hillock are they still there.

I there OK don't see them much tho there Leanne lives with them they in there 80s now dav

Good on them, last time I saw Brian he was having a pint in billy bostons pub now that's some years ago,I remember their daughter Joanne working in Tom whalleys pet shop that was years ago to.

Just see jemmy o show very good I remember it well when Jack had it too they lady who lives in vicarage iam sure she as photo s when it was a bowling green I will ask her when I see her

That sounds good Malc, try get a copy and put it on here.

Morning David she at our today I will ask her

It would be great to see a pic of the bowling green Malc, I've heard stories of the green off the elders who lived on estate but now sadly passed, I remember George foster showing me a pic of a tram or trolley bus on rectory rd near Everton st that pic will probably still be in family somewhere.

dav there,s pics of the bowling green on album under north ashton .

Hi Bri, I've seen that pic but it doesn't give you a good view of the green.

Just spoke to Rita from vicarage she says she as photo of her dad stood with is mates nr bowling green and football pitch she said a lot of is mates on photo got killed in fust war her uncle was goalkeeper Bert Troutman Germany says she will bring some down next time

I remember story of bert troutman Malc, a very hardened goalkeeper who played through a match with a broken neck.

She told mi some stories about him I he was very good keeper

Oh yes he was ex German pow who played for city and clashed with a Birmingham player in 1956, this collision broke his neck but he carried on playing unknowing his real injury.

Every skoo in st helens bourgh got a free book about is life story and you know what Rectory skoo didn't get one because they said its wigan where what you call no man's land up the greeners

yet paying top whack for everything malc.

I know they will stand a cloging they will

Daughter has told me they are enjoying themselves up there, they are having a party in cedar grove good on them.

does your daughter live on here dav ? .

No Bri I think she's been on Facebook, she has friends up there.

Hi Dougie. We have just been to our family grave tidying up. We took a petrol strimmer with us and while we were there we strimmed down the main path as much as we could until we ran out of fuel. We also chopped down loads of the tall weeds as they were looking like young trees. Its such a shame to see the graveyard so overgrown.

how old are you next week malc ? .

He's not far off 58 Bri.

Thy reet David 58 27th and still playing footbaw scored 3 last wik

Yours before me bri 21st or 23rd gets mixed wi pip un curtsy

Sue, Sorry for not saying anything about your post and the work you did in the Churchyard last week, "I've handed my gun back in" with the lack of help the volunteers as been getting this summer in the churchyard saying that, I would like to add that churchyards should not be labelled 'conservation areas' for Bees or anything else as an excuse for neglecting the paths and long grass making it a death trap people when trying to get to your family grave,

Rant over Sue but I hope you get MY meaning, I've looked after my Mam & Dads grave for 45 years and will still will as long as I can all 6 foot of it

today malc . 20th.

Morning bri hope your sober happy belated birthday pal I thout is was 23rd

I understand exactly what you're saying Dougie and totally agree. We'll just have to keep doing our little bit and hope others might do the same

Same as Dougie but you shouldn't aft look after other folk's graves as well if they did there wouldn't be a problem I go up look after my mam n dad s so do my sisters ps they don't even look after there gardens now days

Saw your Lorraine there a few weeks ago Malc

hav,nt had a drink in 4.5 yrs malc.

Hi Dougie I don't think you'll never get on top of tidying Downallgreen Holly trinity Church yard up its a full time job that for a gang of people mabe 4 it really is its a mamouth task its like painting 4th Bridge bi time thys done at one end its go back Recter Abbott as a lot to answer for really wants you lose it it's hard get back I had between 60 to 80 kids playing football on skoo field with Warren and is wife Elaine and 4 or 5 more and you had rector asking how can they get kids playing football on Sunday and I can't get them in church it's simple he didn't encourage them or welcome them rant over

Another greener past away Keneth Lomax brother to Jo or to give her full name Janet Lomax who lives in Florida I have tried to ring her but I can't get a line, RIP Kenneth.

Oh dear that's sad news, Condolences to all the family R.I.P Kenneth.

Sad news. Thoughts and prayers are with Kenneth's family.
R. I. P Kenneth

RIP Kenneth

dougie which lomax are we talking about . any relation to jimmy lomax who lived in leyland green rd ? .

It was bentlegs Bri, yes I think it was jimmys son.

Was it ste lomax they called horizontal champ next door to Tony Harrison

Yes Brian, Leyland Green Road. Janet, Kenneth, Roy and Steven

I remember the Prescott family
Jack was a good friend of my grandfathers ,his wife Doris was friends with my grandmother.also daughters and Beryl and Marlene.
My ( mother ) used to go round to see Doris some Sundays and play cards I suppose the Men were propping the bar up in the Bell????

yes i remember him now .short & stocky was,nt he .was he the oldest susan ? .

I'm pretty sure he was the eldest of the lads Brian, not sure if Janet was older than him

for some reason i cant remember her susan . i dont think there,s any upto date pics of them . iv,e seen the old ones on the downall gr section in album .

Janet will be 78 later this year. Her cousin Patricia Lomax, their fathers were brothers, is a regular attender at Park lane chapel.

still cant remember her susan ? .

WE have decided to tie the knot in a big way, this was in 2013 our 50th wedding anniversary

congrats dougie .

Found this whups why looking through the magazines,? is it a young you

yes it is dougie . very good .

And here's me thinking you was a poor pitman Bri.

Morning David I he's not byte a Bob or 2 bri he was a very good darter tho all is arrows was dead straight not like other player s wobbling to board

Morning Malc, oh I know they didn't call him whupper for nothing, best darter on circuit in his day.

Eileen the wife of Alex Williams passed away this week RIP

Sorry to hear that tumtingle thanks for putting it on, never knew her by name R.I.P Eileen

so sorry to here that . she sometimes got the bus with me at downall gr .

So sorry to hear about,Eileen,she worked at Levertons with my wife,a long time ago.Rip Eileen.

Janet Lomax was the oldest then Keneth ,Kenneth worked on Jack Slater mobile store,and on the pen when we you ,RIP Keneth.

Roy was the same age as our Brent I think. They were always on the same footy team photo at school

Sad loss R.I.P Eileen.

Hi, just to let you know that Rector David Abbott died last Wednesday 29th June {I believe}. No further details to date. He served from 1980 to 2014 and was the longest serving Rector at Holy Trinity. Condolences to his family.

Thanks for info Warr 33, I think he was also youngest Rector to take over after Eric heaton, so sad R.I.P David.

did,nt he stop the walks at jelly sunday ? .

malc very i,ll with covid dav . dont expect any replies soon ? .

Oh sad to hear that Bri, I hope he has a full recovery with no complications, it seems that the virus is back with a vengeance I know loads of people who have it and hospitals are struggling again.

there,s 6 others at the hoist place who have it dav including jeff knowles.

It's spreading like wildfire Bri, my workmates just rung me and asked if I can cover his shifts as hes got it now, unbelievable.

We went for a walk round Car Mill Dam last week not been for years, these photo are some I took of the original over flow that topped -up the Sankey Canal at Black Brook Haydock for it's working life, ANYONE remember the good times we had at Car-mill will make photos bigger forgot how

actually been fishing there dougie in the past .

Whups more history in them four photo's connected to the coal mining than you would ever think possible, you should know this living only a few miles away ? just asking what it was used for in the past

Dougie, not Haydock. Ashton in Makerfield!

We used to go camping at Happy Valley, which is where the brook inflowing to the dam runs.

We would walk through the fields from the Scout hut on Liverpool Road.

If it turned out to be p**ing down, we would instead sleep in the scout hut and enjoy The Skitters. There was a bit more to them back in them days.

Dougie, not Haydock. Ashton in Makerfield!

If I had put Ashton-in-Makerfield you would've said it's in Haydock or Seneley Green and I've no doubt you would be right in some way

yes dougie it covers about 3 borders .

I was under the impression that the dam originally powered the Stanley Slitting Mill, but no doubt someone will tell me that is wrong.

It originally powered Carr Forge and filled a canal. From Carr Forge to Stanley Mill was a canal (not the Sankey Canal).
So, that canal, linking a forge and a mill and being used to transport iron, was an industrial canal?
And that canal was there, in use, long before the Sankey Canal?
So, how can the Sankey Canal be the "first industrial canal"?

When did the amusement park at Carr Mill Dam cease?

There used to be a place on The East Lancs Road called Carr Mill Café: they bought all the ice cream making machinery which had been Ramsdale's Ice Cream (Rose Hill) I don't know if they then went in for any manufacture above and beyond their café sales. (circa 1952)

Here we go again not getting involved but we all know Sankey Canal was the first man made canal dug out from scratch.

Carr Forge Dam and river is in Sheffield it's nothing like the Sankey Canal starting at Black brook St-Helen. Carr Forge Dam is situated nearby to Hackenthorpe, and close to Shire Brook Valley Local Nature Reserve.

Just adding this --Video of the Area--

.
Edit: personal identifier removed.

Thanks, duggie. Enjoyed seeing that vid.

Sad that where I learned my tent craft now built up urban landscape, but so much of the open space I once knew now is.

The Historic Society of Lancashire and Cheshire -

"in March 1720, Edward Hall “secured from Sir William Gerrard of Garswood a 30-year lease of Carr Mill, Ashton-in-Makerfield,"

“There was also a small private canal between the Stanley Copper Mill at Blackbrook (at the head of an arm of the Sankey Navigation) and the mills at Carr Pool (now called Carr Mill Dam, Dougie), higher up the Black Brook.”
"A navigable canal with a boat on it, operating on the half-mile stretch between the mill at Carr and those at Stanley."

So, there you have it, Dougie. A navigable canal with a boat on it, carrying corn and iron, operating on a half-mile stretch of canal between the mill at Carr and those at Stanley.
And that was operational BEFORE the opening of the Sankey Canal in 1757.

Also, the Sankey wasn't "the first man made canal dug out from scratch" as the Romans dug many canals in there near 400 year occupation of this island of ours. Apparently, there was "over 1300 miles of canal" before the Sankey opened.

And, don't forget, the Sankey Canal had been opened nearly a hundred years before St.Helens was invented! You St.Helensers, and your claims to fame, eh.!

PS: You can claim the 'World's First Mechanically Propelled Boat' was invented in (what is now) St.Helens if you want, I'll let you have that one.

World's first steam powered boat by John Smith, maiden voyage on Sankey Canal.

tonker,

So was Carr Mill within the boundaries of the old Ashton UDC?

Is that the same as town boundary?

I never paid that much attention to it when we had an UDC.

Apparently, there's a confluence of two brooks under Carr Mill Dam, somewhere, laaaaike, and the brooks were boundaries of three named places. Ashton in Makerfield was one, I think Billinge another and, possibly, Windle (?, might be Parr (?)). But, there's a lost part of Winstanley there too. Somewhere.
We had some land (family, raaaaight, not me personally!) which some said was in Haydock. Others said it was in Blackbrook but that's not a real place (although it is a councillor ward). Some call it Pewfall. The land registry, who should know their arses from their elbowses about that sort of thing, have it down as being in Ashton in Makerfield.

I do know the head leaseholder of all the land to be the Gerard title as I (personally, raaaaight!) had to pay the said "title" quite a sum of money to have residual covenants removed. That went to the 'trustees of the title' which, conveniently for some, happened to be a Jewish law firm in Westminster!

I recall reading About Gerrard's Sough, not particularly close to Ashton, so I wonder if they had acquired parcels of land discontinuous from that which we usually think of.

Having said that, there is also Gerrard's Bridge .Did a Gerrard commission its construction?

I believe Perry Bridge took its name from Alderman Perry, which in turn led to people calling this portion of Park Brook by that name also. So, slippery things these names, willing to detach and reattach to other bodies.

I recall reading About Gerrard's Sough, not particularly close to Ashton, so I wonder if they had acquired parcels of land discontinuous from that which we usually think of.

Having said that, there is also Gerrard's Bridge .Did a Gerrard commission its construction?

I believe Perry Bridge took its name from Alderman Perry, which in turn led to people calling this portion of Park Brook by that name also. So, slippery things these names, willing to detach and reattach to other bodies.

Gosh! I seem to have gone stereophonic.

The Gerard estate covers an enormous area. It doesn't only cover Bryn.
I think it goes as far to the west as Windle, maybe further.

Gerard Family Papers.

As the house's were built on his land they would make one of the houses responsible for the collection of the ground rent ever year and to see it was paid to Lord Gerards estate, the house that I lived in on Lowe Bank Road was one of these house numbers that HAD to collect, I still have them saved here up to 1984 you never know

This is now the only 6 foot peace of land I attend to in the Churchyard, the volunteers have no chance without help

If you walk on the left of the dam you can see cast iron post with the Ashton in makerfield name on I think that is the boundary.

" the left of the dam"

Is the West bank if you approach from The East Lancs
but it's the East side if you approach along the watercourse (from Happy Valley)?

I assume the former, being left if you are looking at a map, is this correct?

It's a very nice walk from Sankey valley up to Carr Mill Dam Park at ship and walk right upto dam the Brook doesn't half fill up in winter I bet you come back down in a strong dinghy allway back to car park

see you got over covid malc .

Hi bri not good pal back at work ney tho kick on there's loads with it again

I found this in Graces Guide:

1784 Advert: To be Sold by Auction: ALL that well known compleat ROLLING and SLITTING MILL, called STANLEY MILL, seven Miles from Wigan, with the Warehouses, Dwelling-houses, Gardens, and other necessary Buildings contiguous thereto, situate by Sankey Canal, falls into the River Mersey, communicate by Water with Liverpool, Warrington, and Manchester, with the several Towns adjoining the Staffordshire Canal; said Mills are in the Centre of extensive Manufacturies, in Iron, Cotton, &c.
Coals of excellent Quality, are delivered at the Works, on the same Terms as on board the Flats, in the Canal.
Also all that roomy and convenient Rolling Mill, Smith’s Shop, and extensive Yard adjoining, with a stout and well-built Wheel, full 24 Feet diameter; and a Warehouse Feet 30 by 45 Feet, situate upon Carr Pool, a Piece of Water covering 13 Acres, of 8 Yards to the Perch, from whence it falls 24 Feet; where is also a very compleat and well-accustomed Corn Mill, with Drying Kiln, and other useful Conveniences, several Dwelling-houses, Gardens, &c.
There is a navigable Canal with a Boat open it, from the Works at Carr, to those at Stanley, suitable for conveying Goods betwixt the two Places, distant about Half a Mile.
The whole of the Premises are held under Sir Robert Gerrard, Bart. for 21 Years, from February 2d, 1784, subject to an annual Rent of 57l.
From the great command of Water, the Structure of the Wheels, the extent and conveniency of the Buildings, these Works may at a moderate Expence, be accommodated to any Purposes in the Cotton Manufactory, being in a very populous Neighhourhood.
Mr. Rigby, in Billinge, Mr. John Leech, Ashton, or the Clerk of the Works, will shew the Premises

I heard that over half of the residents couldn't read back in the 18th century. So, why would they have a book shop in a slitting mill?

Not only the 18th century!

I am trying online searches for stuff to do with 'Boon work'
Google insists upon returning me results for Book work.

glad to see your up & about malc.

Hope you're ok now Malc, I believe you're Lorraine was talking to my mother in Trinity graveyard last week.

In Wales now hols don't know David not seen her pal it's bad that bloody thing I felt like Repunsul in bed room hope Mrs Lewis OK take care as geet that scaffolding down bri sell it if not on market place they will come and take it down

yes it,s gone malc . thought you,d used all your rest days .

Hi Bri, flag stamper has rung me panicking as bell seems to have shut, someone's told him them who was running it have now got stag at garswood, so he has travel to Ashton now for his daily top up.

i dont know why he,s grumbling dav as it,s cheaper in ashton than the bell ? .

I told him that but I think he likes to keep up with local gossip, it's free on bus and no distance to walk really and as you say his pocket will benefit, back in day I loved going in bell but things change and I certainly wouldn't be a regular these days.

most have been going ashton for years dav .

Don't blame them Bri, I know all bryn lads go there as I used go with them when buffs was active, he just rang me again asking if bell will open again I said how the hell would I know I suppose it's possible them girls are running 2 pubs.

cant answer that dav as it,s over 4 .5 yrs since i had a drink ? .

Needs proper Inn keepers Bell it was open last week Bri not been in since David Houghton passing a lot go pit pony I think not missing out tho if them bell walls could talk they could tell some tales

Last time I heard the Pit Pony has shut

Have they caught anybody for the Downall Green Road shooting yet?
They were probably after Dougie. He'll've been treading on someones toes!

Tonks Dougie lives nearer to you than Downall Green Rd

I was under the impression that Dougie lived behind the Bath Springs, near Bentlegs!

Dougie lives on the estate behind the telephone exchange Ashton

TÒNKER, THA KNOWS NOWT BENTLEGS DOES NOT LIVE ANY WHERE NEAR THE BATH SPINGS

J.W. said you lived across from him, and he lived behind the Bath Springs, across from you!

They should send them Ukrain if they want shoot one another they would shit there pants all lot of them

JW need to get his facts right Never lived across from him,

hav,nt you got anything else to talk about instead of where someone lived ? .

wot do you think of that pic i sent you of curtsy malc .

It's a good un that I couldn't tell at first wardy couldn't ether

how come malc ? . you only live 10yds from him ? .

Talking about someone who only lives 10 yards away put the hat on whups

Gerry's Hat !

wot hat,s that .

TONKERS PISS POT , KEEPS IT UNDER T,BED

still dont understand you bentlegs , wot hat ? .

Cow pat, keep the yed warm

.
Talking about someone who only lives 10 yards away put the hat on whups
-------------I know what I would've said ----------or put--------

Talking about someone who only lives 10 yards away put the hat on BamBam not Whups , it's run it's time I for one think it would be to see it go

A bit long in,t tooth Bam Bam how about number 20

takes about 2 seconds to scroll from 1st post to last post. Click on 1st post then press pg dn button

Page up page down hhhhhhPeter my computer is knackerd so I use my 10in pad and it doesn't, have page up or down

Bentlegs then I agree time for a new thread

At 86 years old today I don't intend to get a new computer Peter, this pad will do.

Happy birthday bentlegs, I will do number 20 shortly.

Happy birthday Bentlegs

ex-Downall Greeners 20