Hit and run..

Started by: momac (12007) 

Last night 9-20 PM.on Ormskirk Rd,a woman was killed and two males seriously injured after a. freelander mounted the pavement and he ran off..R.I.P.

Started: 9th Apr 2022 at 12:39

Posted by: First Mate (724)

They have since arrested two males on suspicion of causing death by dangerous driving and they currently remain in police custody.

Anyone with information is asked to call 0161 856 4741 or report it online or via LiveChat at


An awful tragedy. Rip dear lady

Replied: 9th Apr 2022 at 12:53

Posted by: admin (1210)

It isn't DANGEROUS DRIVING It's Murder

Replied: 9th Apr 2022 at 13:32

Posted by: First Mate (724)

Absolutely Admin. Life in jail seems to mean nothing these days.

Replied: 9th Apr 2022 at 13:38

Posted by: mollie m (6463) 

How awful. That must have happened about 20 minutes after I left Tesco Express a few doors away.

Shocking and, I agree, it's murder BY dangerous driving. I watch a lot of Police documentaries and we hear of things like this happening all over, but for it to happen virtually on my doorstep is very frightening.

Folk going out on a Friday night for a drink, a bit of fun, and a chat don't expect their lives to end and I feel so sorry for the lady and two men who were involved, with serious results.

Whatever their sentence, it's not enough.

Replied: 9th Apr 2022 at 18:36

Posted by: Owd Codger (765)

admin, First Mate, mollie m

All three of you are correct in what you have said.

The amount of dangerous driving, excessive speeding and drink/drug driving today is a national scandal and it is time that some draconian action was taken to deal with the problem, especially when there is a increasing number of fatalities and serious and life threatening injuries involved as a result.


Replied: 10th Apr 2022 at 08:05
Last edited by Owd Codger: 10th Apr 2022 at 08:10:14

Posted by: jathbee (11348)

It was right on my doorstep, so to speak.
I was home and heard all the commotion surrounding the incident but didn't really understand the seriousness of it until later.
The car had mounted the pavement and mowed down people who where outside of the Fifteens bar in centre of Pemberton. The poor people where outside on the pavement, chatting and having a smoke, as is not uncommon. The people who are responsible for this crime should be punished accordingly. Their reckless, selfish actions have devestated not only the lives of the people killed and injured but their families too. An awful, horrific incident.

Replied: 10th Apr 2022 at 08:47

Posted by: roylew (3576)

Totally agree jathbee

Replied: 10th Apr 2022 at 09:54

Posted by: Tommy Two Stroke (9655)

When I read the first account of the accident, on the Manchester Evening News website, the version they gave, was subsequently altered later on in the day, removing the details I am about to state from the original article, which was from memory.

"A Range Rover, which had been stolen, and was being driven by a male, it also had a number of young girls on board, the vehicle stopped outside of the Fifteen Bar, and then the engine revved, and the vehicle shot forward, mounted the pavement, and hit the two men, and one woman, two males who were in the vehicle, one being the driver, ran from the scene, the girls in the vehicle, did the same a short while later, and fled from the scene, but the parents of the girls, made them return to the scene of the accident"

If that account is true, then that will most definitely be murder, and attempted murder.

Replied: 10th Apr 2022 at 10:52

Posted by: tonker (25234) 

Believe half of what you see and none of what you hear - or read in the paper!

Replied: 10th Apr 2022 at 11:05

Posted by: First Mate (724)


Replied: 10th Apr 2022 at 11:19

Posted by: ianp. (776) 

I agree with tonker.
Too much is: 'I heard this from what's-his-name that... - and he got it off what's-her-name...'
It's quite possible that the witnesses don't have identical opinions of what happened, because of all the circumstances: occupied with other things, speed it happened, caught completely unaware, confusement, shock...
Please understand, I am definitely not trying to protect the people that were in that vehicle. Those people should receive the punishment they rightly deserve. Let us hope that there is enough evidence to prove those involved in causing these illegal actions guilty.

Replied: 10th Apr 2022 at 11:30

Posted by: Tommy Two Stroke (9655)

I agree that newspapers publish crap, but I did explain the circumstances of where that information came from, I don't know if that information was true or not.

Replied: 10th Apr 2022 at 11:36

Posted by: Tommy Two Stroke (9655)

Double posting.

Replied: 10th Apr 2022 at 11:36
Last edited by Tommy Two Stroke: 10th Apr 2022 at 11:37:25

Posted by: bambam (2537)

Such a tragedy, I was told by a lady working in the venue that the poor lady only went out to get a signal on her phone.

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 00:34

Posted by: admin (1210)
It isn't "DEATH BY DANGEROUS DRIVING" Its MURDER. A car driven at speed is as lethal as a firearm.

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 09:01

Posted by: gaffer (7096) 

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 09:07

Posted by: jathbee (11348)

Some one I know was in the pub at the time of the awful incident. I will not repeat on here the horrors of what was seen. Except to say that I hope the driver and those others involved, who knew he should not have been driving at all, get what they deserve. I doubt they could ever forget what they were party to and I hope they never will.

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 09:33

Posted by: Owd Codger (765)

But, will they with the soft judicial system in our country today?

A system which does not deter the those who commit crime or even not having the things like a driving license, Insurance, MOT etc for which law abiding citizens have to pay.

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 09:44

Posted by: jathbee (11348)

I think the driver, at least, will get what he deserves.

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 10:08

Posted by: admin (1210)

jathbee... no he won't. Unfortunately, they have done away with Capital Punishment in this country..

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 10:12

Posted by: jathbee (11348)

I know this is not a popular view but I for one am glad they did away with capital punishment.

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 10:17

Posted by: PeterP (9377)

Jathbee so the driver of this car if convicted will probably get minimum jail time and be kept in the lap of luxury . A car is a lethal weapon and murder is murder not death by dangerous driving. Let us have some form of deterent and either bring back the death penalty or the life sentence which is for life not serve a minimum sentence and then let out.

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 10:31

Posted by: Tommy Two Stroke (9655)

The second male will probably receive a charge, under the joint enterprise thing, so the police are still investigating the case, and they know they have got the lad for 'death by dangerous driving' and he is locked up, but they will want to see what the crash investigation team say happened, and they will want to see all the CCTV from the area, and of course what the forensics stuff tells them, so with luck there maybe more charges forthcoming, and if there is any evidence of him 'deliberately' driving towards the people on the pavement, then he should be done for murder, if not 'deliberately' but 'stupidly', then he should be done for manslaughter.

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 10:48

Posted by: jathbee (11348)

I have no problem with a life sentence. And if anyone deserves it, it's the driver of the car that killed and injured those people. It's the legal killing of another human being that I have a problem with.

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 11:32

Posted by: Billinge Biker (1407) 

I dealt with a few fatal accidents in my latter years... Its horrible.... There are four families affected here for the rest of their lives... Its happened before.. It will happen again.... Until the judiciary treat it on a par with murder... Justice will never be served. Already disqualified from driving... Legging it after the incident.... What a hero.

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 12:58

Posted by: Owd Codger (765)

I am old enough to remember Sydney Silverman, the then M.P. for Nelson putting forward the bill in Parliament during the sixties to end capital punishment. People were told that it would be replaced by life Imprisonment and were led to believe that is exactly what the term meant.

I have always been against capital punishment because of the number of cases of innocent people who over many years have been wrongly hanged.

However, after saying that, I do believe that there should be capital punishment in the case of serial killers where there is conclusive proof, especially, now with DNA that persons or persons have committed so many murders.

Why should the taxpayers being paying for murderers so evil to kept in Prison?

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 13:11
Last edited by Owd Codger: 11th Apr 2022 at 13:15:06

Posted by: Platty (1341)

BB: Why your "latter" years? Was it just senior officers dealt with them?

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 13:54

Posted by: jathbee (11348)

Unfortunately the tax payers are paying to keep many wrong doers in this country. And some who should be in prison and are not.

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 13:58

Posted by: Billinge Biker (1407) 

Platty.... My latter years are after doing 6yrs on police motorbikes I transferred to Wigan and Leigh Traffic Unit... In 5yrs I dealt with 5 fatal accidents... Retiring in 2002...always a basic plod... No delusions of grandure.

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 15:49

Posted by: broady (18181) 

Owd Codger,
Someone been convicted today of murdering the MP. No doubt of guilt so why should he be kept in prison, at public expense, for the next few decades?

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 16:26

Posted by: Platty (1341)

jathbee: I agree. Also, I think that people convicted here who are from a foreign country: Pakistan, Rumania, Serbia, etc., should be sent back to do their sentence and be refused entry here ever again.

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 16:36

Posted by: Platty (1341)

BB: Were you ever an outrider to anyone important? (Not including me).

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 16:37

Posted by: Billinge Biker (1407) 

Platty.... Don't want to blow my own trumpet.... I was one of 7 motorcyclists in GMP who was part of the special Escort Group.... Many times from queen to presidents... Politicians to. V. V. I. P. Shook many a hand... Have all the briefing notes to prove same. My favourite of them all... Princess Di.

Replied: 11th Apr 2022 at 17:33

Posted by: mollie m (6463) 

To add to my previous post, I agree that anyone causing death by dangerous driving is, indeed, murder but, unfortunately, death by dangerous driving is the penalty they will pay, and not murder, which is wrong.

Any motorised vehicle is a dangerous weapon and should be treated as such, and to kill another human being using it is, as has been said, like pointing a loaded gun at someone.

The Land Rover was a Freelander which is now a vehicle of choice to steal, but I don't know if the car was stolen or not. Not that it makes any difference now, but I heard (yes, hearsay) that one witness saw one girl jump out of the back and ran off. The driver was chased up a nearby alley by some guys and was pinned to the ground, and two men are now in Police custody.

To all drunk/drug drivers and car thieves, may they rot from their feet to their necks.

The Police do a sterling job, but the Courts are too over-burdened to prosecute to their full force of the law, and the prisons are too full, so chop off their hands. They'll never drive again.

Replied: 12th Apr 2022 at 00:54

Posted by: admin (1210)

We have had the same old diatribe for 30 years now 'THE JAILS ARE FULL'. Answer ...BUILD MORE PRISONS. It's not Rocket Science

Replied: 12th Apr 2022 at 07:46

Posted by: Owd Codger (765)

The prisons are overcrowded because of the lack of stiffer sentences and the nonsense of suspended sentences, serving around half of a sentence, parole and prisons now like holiday camps compared to what they used to be, thanks to the do gooder organisations like the Howard League of Penal Reform.

Since the riot at Strangways twenty five years ago which led to a softening of prison conditions, the prison population has risen by 79%, most of whom are of foreign origin.

A few years ago, a newly elected Mayor of New York doubled all the sentences with the result that the prison population went down and in many states of the USA, prison includes hard labour.

If new prison are to be built, they should be built on some of the remote islands around the country, especially around Scotland

Replied: 12th Apr 2022 at 08:17
Last edited by Owd Codger: 12th Apr 2022 at 08:35:57

Posted by: Owd Codger (765)


I agree, and perhaps even Police Officers like the two un-armed Police Women in Tameside, members of the armed forces like the bands lad in London and also those who kill and injured members of public in bomb attacks like the one in Manchester.

Replied: 12th Apr 2022 at 08:44
Last edited by Owd Codger: 13th Apr 2022 at 00:16:02

Posted by: Domin0 (326)

The maximum sentence for dangerous driving should be much longer, and the prisons could have a lot more cells, get without the gyms, snooker rooms, television, even playing fields, prisons at present are home for home.

Replied: 12th Apr 2022 at 09:19

Posted by: tonker (25234) 

Owd Codger said, " like the two unharmed Police Women in Tameside,"

Of course they were harmed. They were killed stone dead!

Replied: 12th Apr 2022 at 10:17

Posted by: Billinge Biker (1407) 

Yes Tonks... I'm sure he meant un-armed.

Replied: 12th Apr 2022 at 10:26

Posted by: Tommy Two Stroke (9655)

The American 'super-max' prisons are the way to go with the really bad offenders, those given 'whole life tariffs' like the evil scumbag who killed those two Police Woman, as one chap says in the article, they are worse than death.

Replied: 12th Apr 2022 at 10:40

Posted by: tonker (25234) 

"those two Police Woman" were actually two police women!

Replied: 12th Apr 2022 at 19:48

Posted by: Billinge Biker (1407) 

Tonks... You are being The spelling Police...

Replied: 12th Apr 2022 at 19:50

Posted by: tonker (25234) 

"Hello, Hello, Hello, What's all this then, Sunshine"?

Replied: 12th Apr 2022 at 20:11

Posted by: Platty (1341)

Now, now, none of that Sir, none of that. Behave.

Replied: 12th Apr 2022 at 20:13

Posted by: Owd Codger (765)


Corrected if for you.

Like Rutherford who split the atom, I was never outstanding at spelling.

Talk about being pedantic!

Replied: 13th Apr 2022 at 00:20

Posted by: Owd Codger (765)

Apparently, the Police have caught 100 motorists on the same road as the woman was killed not only speeding, but committing more far serious offences with two having their cars taken of them.

I blame a lot of it on people driving with alcohol and drugs in them or even watching Top Gear and Formula One racing.

I also wish the police would visit our street which is like living on a formula one course at times with cars and vans doing 40mph and upwards in spite of discs on the lamp posts indicating 20mph.

Idiots in abundance driving these days!

Replied: 13th Apr 2022 at 08:59

Posted by: WN1 Standisher (450)

I drove down Ormskirk Rd on Sunday afternoon. There were police everywhere. There was 1 with a speed gun just near to the old Half Way House and a van with officers near it about 100 yards further down. Then the 2 streets after Carnegie Library there were police at the end of every street. I had a house call to make in the area and when I was leaving there was a black Ford Fiesta type car with 6 police round it, no sign of the driver. It looked like it was about to be confiscated.

Replied: 13th Apr 2022 at 10:41

Posted by: Tommy Two Stroke (9655)

It is those 'Fast & Furious' films, which have kicked off this 'car meet' thing, but it is an offence to 'race on the highway' with stiff penalties, if caught, and if the idiots don't have the correct documentation, then those idiots get their pride and joy confiscated

Replied: 13th Apr 2022 at 14:24

Posted by: tonker (25234) 

They should sort THESE MEN out!

It's on Bolton Road, Ashton. They'd been weaving between cars all the way from Platt Bridge.
Probably, no licence, to MoT, no Tax, no insurance.
I see them regularly, same stretch of road, plus off-road motorcycles with no number plates, rider has no helmet, obviously illegal.

Replied: 13th Apr 2022 at 15:23

Posted by: Billinge Biker (1407) 

Probably right on most counts... But road legal quads crash helmets are not required.... Similarly 3 wheeled trikes.

Replied: 13th Apr 2022 at 15:26

Posted by: tonker (25234) 

Registration plates are required. As you well know.
Now, how ironic would it be, if that quad was fully road legal and the rider fully licensed and insured, only to have had his number plate stolen by some scally when he wasn't looking?

Replied: 13th Apr 2022 at 15:33

Posted by: AngelWood (759)

Another hit and run, this time in Ince. A 2 year old child hit by a motorbike.

Replied: 13th Apr 2022 at 16:07

Posted by: anniedingle (138)

These joy riders are bored all the time thank god they got all who were involved has the Kady was only visiting relatives in wigan

Replied: 13th Apr 2022 at 17:06

Posted by: First Mate (724)

Replied: 17th May 2022 at 14:33

Posted by: GOLDEN BEAR (4774) 

This piece of worthless *HITE should if/when found guilty should be given "A WHOLE LIFE SENTENCE " anything less is a laughing stock and an insult to the 3 children that has been left without a mum . We all become brainwashed by watching these tv shows such as "police interceptors " Inside the force "" They are a joke when at the end one hear's the sentence's handed down! The crimes in this country are so outdated and behind the times it beggars belief . For me bread and water and hard labour would be order of the day !!!!GB

Replied: 17th May 2022 at 14:59

Posted by: admin (1210)

Nine years out in 5.. If it was a member of my family I would have stood up in Court and told him that when he was released I would find him and kill him myself.' I wouldnt care what happened to me after. That would give him something to look forward to.. Its about time the judicial system in this country was given a MASSIVE overall regards sentencing. The public on a whole are fed up and disgusted with the lenient sentences handed out by the Judges, who are out of touch with with the feelings of the population of this country.

Replied: 17th May 2022 at 15:28

Posted by: mortarmillbill (778)

It only takes 1 person to object if they think that the sentence is unduly lenient.

Details are on the website.

Replied: 17th May 2022 at 15:43

Posted by: GOLDEN BEAR (4774) 

ADMIN ?? You sound like a man after mine own ! BRAVO WELL DONE ,,

Replied: 17th May 2022 at 16:25

Posted by: admin (1210)

I've just been informed that the sentence was only for 7 years 2 years were added because of an earlier prosecution.. Makes it worse and that the car was his??? How can he afford a car like that???? Well we can guess...

Replied: 17th May 2022 at 16:28

Posted by: Billinge Biker (1407) 

I'm with Admin on this.... and Yes I would gladly wait for his release if it was one of mine.

Replied: 17th May 2022 at 18:05

Posted by: admin (1210)

Just read hes parents are devastated!!! They are partly to blame. They knew he had recently bought the car and that he had no insurance, hadn't passed a test, disqualified from driving etc etc. yet they allowed him to drive it. WHY did they allow him to buy a car like that obviously it was parked at their address where they lived. Sill can't get my head around such a lenient sentence You get a longer sentence for making a Racist remark these days... and HOW could he afford to buy a car like that at 19.

Replied: 17th May 2022 at 19:43

Posted by: admin (1210)

It looks like you need to be a VICTIM to ask for a review of what you consider a too lenient sentence. I hope the people involved solicitors will take this up.

Replied: 17th May 2022 at 20:49

Posted by: Tommy Two Stroke (9655)

Disgusting sentence, it should have been twice as long as that, and preferably a life sentence.


If he can afford a car like that, then he will have been able to afford the best lawyers available, hence the lenient sentence

Replied: 17th May 2022 at 21:32

Posted by: admin (1210)

More likely his solicitor would be financed by LEGAL AID...

Replied: 17th May 2022 at 22:00

Posted by: First Mate (724)

Replied: 17th May 2022 at 22:09

Posted by: wnwanderer (43)

The courts are crying out for magistrates, and from some posts on here there should be a glut of willing volunteers

Replied: 18th May 2022 at 19:16

Posted by: admin (1210)

First Mate.. looks like Prison is a good deterrent..

Replied: 18th May 2022 at 19:44

Posted by: jathbee (11348)

The sentence was a disgrace. I just hope he can live with what he has done but I doubt people like him have any kind of a conscience.

Replied: 19th May 2022 at 09:51

Posted by: admin (1210)

jathbee.. conscience!!! he will probably be bragging about it with his scummy mates in prison.I would love to speak to one of the judges and ask them why such a lenient sentence after MURDERING someone and badly injuring two other people..? he should have got a LIFE sentence As I previous post short jail sentences are on deterrent at all Probably if he had got 12 lashes with the birch he would think twice before committing another crime. Ask the people of the I.O.M. When the island demolished the birch the crime rate dramatically increased. Ive said it before and no doubt will continue to say it. The Do Gooders, Liberal, Civil Liberties, Penal Reform, Howard League, brigades have ruined this country.

Replied: 19th May 2022 at 11:32

Posted by: basil brush (18274)

they really need to have a clear out with these judges, when the coppers eventually arrest people, and it goes to court they don't get punished.

Replied: 23rd May 2022 at 11:07


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