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Photo-a-Day Archive
Photo-a-Day Archive

Photo-a-Day  (Tuesday, 19th July, 2022)

Jeremiah Parr

Jeremiah Parr
Wrongly dated grave in St Davids Haigh.

Photo: Mick Byrne  (Panasonic DMC-TZ100)
Views: 2,256

Comment by: The Real James Hanson on 19th July 2022 at 00:05

Jeremiah was a bullfrog
Was a good friend of mine
I never understood a single word he said
But I helped him a-drink his wine
And he always had some mighty fine wine

Comment by: Derek Platt on 19th July 2022 at 00:13

How do you know it was wrongly dated Mick, where you thereat the time.

Comment by: irene roberts on 19th July 2022 at 07:21

A friend took me to see this many years ago. I was so fascinated by the April 31st date that I failed to notice until I saw this photo that the young lad was only 11 years old. I think because it is such an old grave and such an old-fashioned name I had imagined Jeremiah to be an old man.

Comment by: Abram Alice on 19th July 2022 at 07:28

Maybe in those days the months were longer.
Ive been into the nearby pub a few times but never into the graveyard.

Comment by: PeterP on 19th July 2022 at 08:15

I Wonder on what date the child did die? This happened to my mother -in-laws casket only a few years ago. When we went to bury the ashes I noticed they had engraved the wrong date on the casket. They said they would take it away and change the date. We did not attend the second burial so just hope the date was changed.

Comment by: Veronica on 19th July 2022 at 08:58

I imagine many people at that time weren’t able to read never mind know how many days there were in each month…
Imagine the scene ...”On what day did the child die?” …”T’was on the last day of April Sir”… the rest is history… who knows.!?

Comment by: Syd Smith on 19th July 2022 at 09:45

No calender's back then, if you wanted to know the day of the week you would have to walk into the town to buy a newspaper.
If you wanted to know what time it was and you couldn't see the church clock you would have to light a candle.

Comment by: Roy on 19th July 2022 at 10:17

Just as a matter of interest.
I have an 1871 calendar (no i'm not that old) courtesy of Google and there were 30 days in April, i didn't think otherwise, April 30th was a Sunday.

Comment by: Phil Taylor on 19th July 2022 at 10:47

Derek Platt has had a nightmare there!

Comment by: Poet on 19th July 2022 at 11:51

A grave error .

Comment by: Ray on 19th July 2022 at 12:02

There is no 31st in April, the month ends on the 30th.

Comment by: Cyril on 19th July 2022 at 14:26

A pity the headstone is now broken after all the years it's been stood standing being a loving memorial to Jeremiah and Margaret Parr.

A natural occurrence perhaps or an act of mindless vandalism? but whatever caused it to fall and break it was a good piece of stone with the Inscriptions and Epitaph (Job.9:12) still being clear after 151 years of Haigh winter weathering, a lot of headstones would have become badly eroded.

Comment by: . Ozy . on 19th July 2022 at 15:44

I would be the very last person to cast aspersions with regard to you frequenting the Balcarres Alice , but like yourself I wouldn’t be in too much of a hurry to get into the graveyard either , as the way I see it , we’re all destined to end up in there soon enough anyway when the celestial landlord calls time .

Also , I suppose it wouldn’t be that unreasonable to imagine that the stonemason got the month wrong either , rather than the day of the month …..?

Well ! , if not probable , then at least possible .

Following on….further down the headstone , we read that another Parr , Margaret this time at the relatively young age of 22 , possibly a sister or cousin , also met her maker within a matter of weeks of Jeremiah’s demise .

What in tarnation was going on up at Haigh in
1871 ?

Comment by: Derek Platt on 19th July 2022 at 15:49

Oops, I guess I'm not that observant. When you are retired dates and days just don't seem to register anymore. Sorry Mick about my comment earlier.

Comment by: Pw on 19th July 2022 at 16:25

Derek,I too looked at it a few times before I spotted the date.A good talking point Mick.

Comment by: John on 19th July 2022 at 16:35

There might have been an epidemic of some sort around that time as there were 32 burials at St David's in March and April alone in 1871. That seems a lot for such a small place.

Comment by: irene robertsI on 19th July 2022 at 16:54

Ozy, I haven't heard the expression "what in tarnation" for years! I wish people still used those expressions instead of the language we hear today. The worst my parents ever said was "by the crin", and if my Dad was flabbergasted by something he would say "Owd Mon!", I remember Veronica mentioning "cart road" some time ago, and it took me straight back to my Uncle Billy telling me to "be careful crossin' 't'cart road". Sorry to go off the subject of the grave but one memory triggers another on here, and what's the harm in sharing them? I love to hear little tales of Wigan World members' childhood memories.

Comment by: PeterP on 19th July 2022 at 16:57

John take your pick of epidemic's Smallpox Typhus Yellow fever Scarlet fever and cholera were all doing the rounds in 1871.

Comment by: Veronica on 19th July 2022 at 17:37

I have a number of death certificates with ‘fever’ , also ‘apoplexy’ plus death from childbirth written on them around that time.
Irene one of my dad’s expressions was ‘Bythecrin’ when his horses went down, the emphasis was on ‘Byyyyythe chin’. …:o)) It would be something a lot worse these days!!! I often see ffs, I couldn’t work it out at first but now I know.

Comment by: irene robertsI on 19th July 2022 at 18:53

Stick to our old words, Dolly dear! "Is this a free country or a bloomin' Sunday School?", as they say in our much-loved film, Brief Encounter. I'm sure Mrs. Baggot would have nipped any offensive language in the bud in her Station Buffet!

Comment by: DTease on 19th July 2022 at 19:11

You shouldn’t be able to work it out now, Veronica. What would the nuns say!

Comment by: Poet on 19th July 2022 at 19:24

My dad used to say ' Is it Hanover ' , by which he meant ' is it heck ' or ' what you say is rubbish ' . Or a slight variation ' Does it Hanover '
e.g. The Wheatsheaf has the best beer in town !
" Does it Hanover , it tastes like weasel wee " .
I never heard anyone else but my dad say this and have no clue to how the
expression came about .

Comment by: Pw on 19th July 2022 at 19:43

Poet,Must have heard and said that expression thousands of times and never given it a second thought it was something we said.

Comment by: Roy on 19th July 2022 at 19:56

Dave, both my parents used that expression.

Comment by: . Ozy . on 19th July 2022 at 20:00

Seeing as how Irene has somehow imperceptibly managed to subtly navigate us onto the topic of olde Englishe expressions , I wonder if anyone other than myself is familiar with the term “ What the Hanover ! “ , often spoken with an upward inflection and used as an expression of surprise or disapproval …or both .
My mother used it frequently ……
…..or perhaps it wasn’t a term commonly used in darkest Wiggin.

See !…..unlike yo lot, I’m not originally from Wigan , although my immigration application has been subject to review since 1985…….
……and with any luck it’ll
be rejected.

I just thought I’d slip that last bit in before anyone else did.

Comment by: Anne on 19th July 2022 at 20:02

Poet, I used to hear it quite often when I was a child. It always puzzled me as I always understood it was a city in Germany.

Comment by: Roy on 19th July 2022 at 20:05

Google, The Lancashire Telegraph. What the Hanover is this.

Comment by: Roy on 19th July 2022 at 20:12

OZY, it is to do with replica brass guineas.
Google what i have asked Poet to google.

Comment by: irene robert on 19th July 2022 at 20:20

Yes, I recall "What the hanover" . I never gave a thought as to its origins! It's nice to talk on here with people who use the old expressions and no swearing. Thanks!

Comment by: . Ozy . on 19th July 2022 at 20:24

Beat me to it there poet but it would appear that the term in one form or another was more widely used than I had imagined .

In common with yourself and others on here evidently , I too am at a loss as to the origin of the expression .

Comment by: Pw on 19th July 2022 at 20:32

I don’t think we said with an H.

Comment by: Veronica on 19th July 2022 at 20:32

I always wondered who ‘San Fairy Ann’ was - aye ‘un Peggy Martin.
Dtease Nuns can lose their rag they argue amongst themselves I believe. I doubt ‘ffs’ is mentioned though, if it is they just say the abbreviation ….like me when I read it. ;o))

Comment by: . Ozy . on 19th July 2022 at 20:41

Further to my previous post , I had a look on Google ….. ( Good old Google )….. and turned up an article in the Lancashire Telegraph concerning this very topic. Seems it has something to do with counterfeit brass guineas.

I can’t do links but I feel sure that Cyril would gladly obliged if you asked him nicely .

( Good old Cyril )
hip. hip.

Comment by: Cyril on 19th July 2022 at 20:47

Peter P, yes and thank God for the vaccines and antibiotics that treat those conditions that then very often ended in death.

I'd never heard of hanover before now. It was always 'is it heckus,' 'is it heck' or by the heck, and as Irene has said with 'owd mon' - usually with a 'tek a look ur that' on the end, and has Veronica said 'by the crin, and crivvens sometimes also prefixed with a 'by the,' was another word often said instead of an expletive, though if us kids had said those words we'd probably have got a pelt.

Comment by: . Ozy . on 19th July 2022 at 20:51

I’m struggling to keep up with this avalanche of posts here.

Bugger !

Oh ! and that’s another old English expression often used by my dad , usually when he’d missed the nail and hit his thumb with the hammer .

Comment by: Roy on 19th July 2022 at 20:55

Folks, please google.....The Lancashire Telegraph. What the Hanover is this.

Comment by: Roy on 19th July 2022 at 21:00

Veronica, Google....... Ca ne fait rien

Comment by: . Ozy . on 19th July 2022 at 21:10

O.k. one last time then that’s me done .

San Fairy Ann Veebs is a corruption of the French
ça ne fait rien , which translates as, that does , or makes nothing.
I would use the phrase if wanted to say :

“ it doesn’t matter “ .

I used to frequently drive past the entrance to a farm on the A50 between Cheadle and Derby which had a sign at its entrance saying
“ San Fairy Ann Farm “.

Thanks for the memory jerker.

Comment by: James Hanson on 19th July 2022 at 22:38


He went home talking to himself and to the moon, that was very high and small, stumbling at the flashes of moonlight from the puddles at his feet, wondering "What the Hanover!" then laughing confidently to the moon, assuring her this was first class, this was.

Comment by: Poet on 20th July 2022 at 09:47

Roy , the Telegraph site seems to have crashed . Perhaps you could give a brief summary .

Comment by: Veronica on 20th July 2022 at 10:21

Gadzooks! Who’d have thought it…

Comment by: Mal on 20th July 2022 at 12:15

An old story goes that a man from Wigan who's wife had passed on wanted the inscription "She was thine" on the headstone. When he went to see it , it said "She was thin". Not happy with this, he complained that the letter "e" has been missed off. The stone mason assured him he would correct the mistake. The next time the man visited the grave he saw that it now said. "E she was thin"

Comment by: . Ozy . on 20th July 2022 at 13:10

I’ll have to go and change mi underpants now Mal.
I’ve just wet misel ‘ laughing at that one.

Comment by: Veronica on 20th July 2022 at 13:15

That’s funny Mal whether it’s true or not…;o))

Comment by: Cyril on 20th July 2022 at 14:02

Ozzy, I've only just seen your request, 'ere it is:

Poet, being brief Roy is correct with replica guineas from Royal House of Hanover Kings George 2nd and 3rd which were emblazoned with advertisements on the reverse and given away to customers buying various items, but mostly tea.

Perhaps a lot of wiganworlders were trying to access the Telegraph site - which caused the crash.

Comment by: . Ozy . on 20th July 2022 at 17:57

I reckon this idea of going back to posts from previous days is brill .

Not only is it a good laugh , but it doesn’t disrupt the current p.a.d., or cause offence to the o.p.

So I’ll see you all again last Wednesday then .

…The Deranged Cleaver.

I’m seriously considering using this moniker , or something similar , as my new ID actually.

Comment by: Roy on 21st July 2022 at 10:28

I agree with your last posting Ozy.
Further to what Cyril has posted............
Although dated in the reigns of George 11 and 111 they were produced from the 1870's onwards and made to look slightly worn to appear more authentic. People tried to pass these as legal tender and were often rebuked with ''You can keep your Hanover'' referring to the Royal House. Later the phrase passed into Lancs dialect, with, for example ''What the Hanover are you playing at'' and probably ''Will i Hanover accept that'' etc. The 'coins' can still be purchased at coin fairs for a couple of pounds each

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