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Photos of Wigan
Photos of Wigan



Photo-a-Day Archive
Photo-a-Day Archive

Photo-a-Day  (Wednesday, 18th May, 2022)

Hic Bibi


Hic Bibi
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Photo: Alan Banks  (Panasonic DMC-TZ60)
Views: 1,865

Comment by: Helen of Troy on 18th May 2022 at 07:02

Perhaps someone could tell us the historical background of Hic Bibi again.
Nice photo Alan , love the dog !

Comment by: Poet on 18th May 2022 at 07:41

Nice picture Alan . I went by here a day or two ago after a rain shower and the scent of pollen was overwhelming. Anyone with hay fever would have a problem .
I wonder how dogs cope with their enhanced sense of smell .

Comment by: PeterP on 18th May 2022 at 07:52

strange name for a dog

Comment by: Veronica on 18th May 2022 at 08:34

A cute dog - loads of space to scamper about for him/her. Interesting history of the place imagining hundreds of soldiers resting up there and gulping the refreshing well water…I suppose the ‘well’ has been filled in!

Comment by: irene roberts on 18th May 2022 at 09:29

I just know it means "Here I Drink", Helen, but I'm sure someone can explain the historical background. I love the dog and the field of rape....such a cheering colour.

Comment by: Roy on 18th May 2022 at 09:49

Helen, refer back to Poet's P a D on Friday 6th May, re Hic Bibi history.

Comment by: Poet on 18th May 2022 at 10:13

The army certainly passed this way taking refreshment at the Well , but it's debatable whether or not the place got its name from Cromwell uttering the phrase ' Hic Bibi ' .
Many argue , perhaps more plausibly, that the latin speaking monks from the monastery had erected a sign saying Drink Here , meaning the water was safe .

Comment by: PS on 18th May 2022 at 10:20

If there was a sign , it would have been a rather ghostly reminder of the long gone way of life that Henry 8 had destroyed.

Comment by: Edna on 18th May 2022 at 10:24

Love the colours, and the dog is lovely.Nice photo Alan.

Comment by: Dave on 18th May 2022 at 12:56

I agree with Poet . I was going to ask on your previous post Poet about the monastery , where it was , and if there are any remains of it . Also I read , the water smelt of poo in those days and the poor drank gin instead of beer , as it was cheaper , and the authorities for some reason were more flexible as to who could sell it . Either way any ban failed . Would welcome any further insights regarding the monks .

Comment by: Helen of Troy on 18th May 2022 at 13:13

Thanks Roy, I took up your advice.

Comment by: Poet on 18th May 2022 at 15:37

Dave , I believe Hic Bibi was one of three holy wells in the Leyland Hundred .
They would have been maintained by monks from Penwortham Abbey .
Alas , all that remains of the Abbey is a stone cross base .
The abbey was founded by Warin de Brussel , Baron of Penwortham who was also the progenitor of the Standish family . One of his descendants, Radolphus adopted the name de Standish after the name of his manor .

Comment by: Gary on 18th May 2022 at 16:54

Penwortham was never a full Abbey - it was a tiny Priory, St Mary, an offshoot of Evesham Abbey, dissolved in 1540. The Priory may have had up to five monks of the Benedictine order in its medieval heyday, but the limited information available seems to imply there were three at most when it was dissolved - as Poet says above, possibly as early as 1535 - being one of the lesser priories.
Again, I agree with Poet regarding Cromwell - he certainly drank in that area but "hic bibi" and Latinate phrasing is never associated with him. His language was Midland English, the nearest today being the Norfolk dialect with a few West Country style round vowels thrown in.
As in the NE today, "ton" suffixes e.g. Adlington, Pemberton would have spoken as "toon."

Comment by: John G on 18th May 2022 at 17:45

Poet&Gary: I’am very impressed with your knowledge with that period of time, both of you have put some good posts in.
It’s just that the history I’ve read and learned over that time period involving the drinking of water was very taboo, you would be taking your life in your hands if you could not fully trust it’s source.
That’s why they drank ale or wine, to be on the safe side.
And even drinkers in the taverns would stick a red hot poker in the ale for good measure.
However who am I to say other wise, if Hic Bibb was a well known reliable source of drinking water so be it.

Comment by: DTease on 18th May 2022 at 19:49

Poet, perhaps the Monks were telling the locals “ Please don’t do anything else in this watter ‘cos us Monks affert drink it”

Comment by: . Ozy . on 18th May 2022 at 20:57

In common with the monks of yesteryear, I have to confess that I also feel far from overly confident with regard to the quality of the water in the Wigan area.

This probably being the predominant reason that I generally insist that my beverages are imported from either Germany, France or Australia, and usually with an abv exceeding 13.5 % ,....although I do make the rare exception where Vimto is concerned, inasmuch as I am prepared to allow a little bit of Wigan water, boiled vigorously for at least 5 minutes mind, to be introduced into the liquor.

Vimto!....now there's a word to be conjured with........The name of this trademarked product must surely have its origin in some ancient Mediterranean language.

I'm almost tempted to google it to be honest, but as there appears to be a haze of blue vapour rising above my chip pan, I feel it it may prove to be more prudent if I left it until tomorrow , as I fail to recognise any advantage of knowing the origin of a trademark, over sitting in the rain amidst the remnants of a burnt out Anderson shelter.

Especially considering the ongoing situation in Eastern Europe.
....I mean..
Who's going to give a bugger about Vimto when the ICBMs start landing in Bottling wood?

Comment by: DTease on 18th May 2022 at 22:21

Bottling’ Wood Ozy? That’s a bit close to home for my liking.
Wist not need worry about cookin’ t chips if one o them theer ICBMs faws on us!

Comment by: Dave on 19th May 2022 at 01:11

This suggests it could have been a monastic banishment cell as mentioned regarding Roger Norris, who I am not sure if they were trying to forgive him or just trying to get rid of him or both?

Comment by: . Ozy . on 19th May 2022 at 04:37

If the Ruskies could just manage to land a small one on the galleries DTease, that would save the council a job and may go some way towards ultimately knocking a few bob off my obscenely exorbitant council tax bill.

Comment by: Veronica on 19th May 2022 at 07:49

I chucked my chip pan out years ago…. I find it easier making my own roasted Wedges. Plus I do keep the odd bag of oven chips in the freezer. The blue vapour brings back memories of my next door neighbour who fell asleep when the chip pan caught fire and set fire to the kitchen! I hope you have a good hosepipe and water supply near the owd rusty shelter Ozy. I think you would be better moving to Hic Bibi.

Comment by: DTease on 19th May 2022 at 10:24

Oven chips! Oven chips Veronica? It's life Captain but not as we know it.
O the shame of it! Oven chips in Lancashire! Where will it all end I ask myself. Next thing you know they'll be putting the fish in there as well!

Comment by: Veronica on 19th May 2022 at 12:13

I do do Dtease… but only M&S because I’m worth it ….. I likes a bit of salmon though… with a slice of lemon mmmm:

Comment by: Barrie on 19th May 2022 at 19:43

In a booklet titled "Standish-Eighty years of Change-1901-1981" compiled by S.Aspinall there is a section "around the Village" and mentioned is Hic-bibe relating to the old bridleway between Standish and Bogburn Hall Coppull that passes by the ancient spring of Hic-bibe that, according to legend passed down the years, was the drinking well where Cromwell stopped and drank from. He was reported to have put up an inscription "hicbibi" or "here I drank" A map of the area dated 1763 gives the spelling Hic-bibe based on the monastic land where the spring was. As a young lad growing up in Standish with occasional family walks round that area I was unware of the tale.

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