Wigan Album

Is this, walking up from Millgate, then turning the top corner, to take you down to the Market Place? Wasn't the Empire Cinema round the corner?

Hi Albert...I think this could be the Wiend Millgate entrance but I always thought Tickles (sell anything) shop was situated in the position where the warehouse is shown, I could be wrong!....If you turn right where the car is you will as you say find yourself in the Market Place..No Albert the Empire cinema wasn't in the Wiend it was in the next little opening down the Market Place, about 20 yards up on the LHS....Happy memories!...Bob A

I don't recognise this at all as the Wiend

I don't think this is the Weind

Yes this was the view from Millgate

Looks like commercial yard to me

the commercial yard did not have a slope in it like that

Is the archway above the car still in place as the frontage of Gallimore's

IS THIS THE ALLY WAY BETWEEN KING ST AND LIBERY ST

This IS The Wiend. Over to the right and out of sight would be the John Bull Chophouse.

So is the printer's place on the left where the two men are standing ?

This is the Wiend! looking from Millgate, Sidebottom printers is the building on the left hand side of the photo.

This photo was shown on August 2012 in places.

This photo, submitted by RON HUNT, was already in Album, Places, Wiend.

Whoever took this photo deserves a pat on the back for “preserving” this part of Wigan and thank you Eunice for posting so that we can all enjoy.

this is the weind but before the early sixties I started on buses in 1962 and that big building was not there wct canteen was there a large wooden building

John Bull Chop House is in Coopers Row not the Wiend.

Excellent photo, brings back some memories, I distinctly remember Sidebottoms on the left.

I seem to recollect, that at one time, there was a snack bar on the corner of The Weind, with Millgate, on the left hand side, as you turned into The Weind.

Albert; Look at photo #13769 which is 1st on 3rd row in Album, Places, Millgate.
A comment reads:-
Comments by Gerry, 1st March 2010
if the photographer had just turned to the lft a bit he would have pictured Slow Joes the best cafe in Wigan Pudding chips peas tea bread and butter for Two and Four. thats about eleven new pence.. and also just up from slow joes was an electrical shop run by an old lady that new everything about ohms watts and volts she used to fascinate me."
Wonder if this is the `snack bar` which you mention.

Thanks all for your comments This photo has hung on my wall since my son got it out of the tavern pub a few years ago

Ernest, surely you would turn right for Slow Joe's. On the left hand corner, was that not where Tom Whalley's pet shop was?

Ernest. I remember the snackbar being there, 1959/60. One evening, I arrested a chap leaving there. He had previously committed a serious assault on a person, in a pub, in the Market Place.

up to about 1950 the big arch doors were the entrance to Wm Parks Iron and steel warehouse ( Later moved to their works at Clarington Forge) As a schoolboy I collected a steel bar from there in 1948 an carried up Scholes to Whelley school for a metalwork project. There was large stocks of horse shoe iron and nails there

dave johnson; I don`t remember Slow Joe`s or the location of Tom Whalley`s pet shop in Millgate. I remember Tom Whalley`s pet shop off Millgate i.e. photo #7686 which is last on 2nd row and you`ve made the first comment!

Going off on a bit of a tangent, as you entered The Wiend from Market Place there was a barber's (I think every Wigan male teenager in the fifties had their first crew cut there) and an upmarket menswear shop - I think it was Harry ? - does anyone remember the surname?

DerekB; Look at photo#2020 which is first in Album, Places, Wiend. A comment reads:-
Comments by John Heaton, 28th July 2010
The gentleman on the left of the picture is my father Ron Heaton who took over "Harry Jones" outfitters circa 1965.

Good to see so many comments about The Wiend.I worked at Tom Whalleys Pet Shop as a Saturday boy when I was 15 years old in 1957,We were at No.11.Opposite was Tickles Haberdashery the only other traders were Harry Jones (Bespoke Taylor),Joe Kennedy (Bookie),George Lyon (Gents Barber).As you came onto Millgate there was a cafe on the left corner with the Wiend.Late Tom Whalley moved into Millgate next to the cafe.I have mentioned before that below the Pet Shop in Millgate was an old prison.There was no access but by shining a torch through a hole in the floor boards you could clearly see the cell doors.The Shop in The Wiend was larger than it looked,there were three floors plus a cellar.We opened up the cellar to house the fish tanks and found an even lower cellar.In this lower cellar was a huge brick arched tunnel that ran under The Wiend.It was full of old brick rubble and we never risked going in.Happy,happy days.

Just because the original photo was posted under the "Wiend" doesn't mean it's correct. I think this is Bretherton Row in between Library St and King St and the pic was taken from outside Wallpaper Supplies side entrance. The warehouse at the top has been demolished and there is now access to Wallgate opposite the GPO.

This is the wiend.And there are still cobbles on the road.Look on google maps.This view is looking from millgate.

Definitely the Weind. In the 1950s and early 60s, I was forever going up there to Sidebothams to leave orders or collect orders for my employer. Although the quickest way there from my place of work would have been straight up Market St and across Market Place, I always went across the Market Square, and via Mesnes St and Standishgate, and entered the Weind from this entrance in Millgate, to waste a bit of time!

Graham Taylor – this isn’t Bretherton Row.
Bretherton Row has never had a building like the warehouse pictured running across it at right angles to the street line.
The 1890s 25 inch to the mile Ordnance Survey map of the town centre clearly shows individual buildings on it, and Bretherton Row is shown as a more or less straight thoroughfare running between Wallgate, and what is now Arcade St (then known as Elbow Lane). Other large scale maps from different periods also show this - no warehouse running at right angles to the street line.
If this building had been in Bretherton Row, it would have been clearly featured, and the thoroughfare would have had a different shape entirely.
Most of the people posting above remember the Weind when it looked like this. Many of them have memories of working there, and one can even identify a person whose business was there.
It is the Weind. QED.

This is quite definitely the Wiend. From the 1940's to the 60's, my mother had the grocer's shop almost opposite to the Wiend. Tom Whalley's pet shop was on the bottom left-hand corner of the Wiend (out of the picture) until he moved to the yard down Millgate between the Salvation Army and the Borough Café (chip shop). When he moved, the shop became a ladies' dress shop. Going up on the left was Sidebotham's printers. I can't remember what was after that but in the top left-hand corner there were 2 houses with steps leading up to the door. The arch-way at the top was the entrance to Wm.Park's Iron & Steel warehouse but later, as Watchalot said, was used by the Wigan Corporation Transport employees. On the left, walking towards the Market Place, was Tickles shop. Then came another printer's, the owners name was Griffin. Next came Harry Jones, men's outfitter, and finally Russell Lyon, hairdresser.
On the opposite side to the pet shop was Crawford's wool warehouse. Round the bend was a shop where you could take your own bottle and buy wine from the barrel. Beyond there my memory fails me. Someone mentioned the lady who knew all about electricity; that was Mrs Jolley whose shop was just round the corner in Millgate.

Garry; It is not the Weind - it is the WIEND.

Ernest - you will have to stand corrected on the spelling of Weind, I think.
An enamel street sign used to be at the Market St entrance to the Weind, and that was spelt with the 'e' before the 'i'.
In the 1960s, I questioned the spelling of this sign, as at the time I was having the 'i' before 'e' rule drummed into me at school. I was told that it was an old English word for an alley or passageway, and that the correct spelling was 'WEIND'. A similar word 'wynd' is used in Scotland for thoroughfares of this nature.
There are numerous mentions of 'Weinds' in the Preston Court Leet records,all with the 'e' before 'i' spelling.
There are also Weinds in Garstang, all with the 'e' before 'i' spelling - Stoops Hall Weind, Thomas's Weind, Storey's Weind, Nickson's Weind, Grayston's Weind, Fletcher's Weind, Carrick Weind, and Eagle and Child Weind.
Weind is the correct spelling.

The small printers near to Tickles shop that I mentioned on the map photo was owned by a man called Arthur, I remember when I worked at Wigan Print we obtained a ruling machine from him and had to dismantle it to remove it, some parts of it from the upstairs window, does anyone else recall? P.S. definitely the Wiend/Weind

You can see a photo of the printers 'Wiend Press' on Places Wiend April 2010. the one with 8 comments.

Garry - I remember the sign with the WEIND spelling. I used to wonder about it as well. Thanks for the explanation.

Garry; I walked down the Wiend today and the nameplate at the Market Place end reads Wiend.

Yes Ernest, but a few years ago when the council did new signposting around that area, local historians kicked up a bit of a fuss in the local papers because they had spelt 'Weind' incorrectly as 'Wiend' on the new signs.

Garry, It's not the first time the council has made mistakes on street signs. McCormack Drive near St. Pat's, should be McCormIck Drive, named after a well-known parish priest at that church. Fourmarts Road on the industrial estate off Scot Lane should probably be "Foumarts", old dialect word for polecats.

John - you're right regarding Wigan Council's history with street signs!
I remember in the 1980s, that busy road connecting Scholes and Birkett Bank had a sign at either end. One read 'Scholefield Lane', and the other 'Schofield Lane'.

Apologies....after after reading comments you are right it is the Wiend.

Albert; Look in Stuff, Wigan Streets 1890 and you`ll find Wiend.

My last comment should have been addressed to Garry!

Garry; I looked in Stuff, 1825 Directory and found places in the Weint.
Then I put weint in Google and found:-

http://www.aboutmyarea.co.uk/Cheshire/Neston/CH64/Who-When-Why/Answers-to-Correspondents/132920-Why-Pykes-Weint

Fancy that!

At the time this photo was taken I was working at Sidebothams printers. the first offices you see on the left were used by the Lancashire Evening Post where they had a small machine for printing the late news on front page of already printed newspapers. Next was an entrance to Sidebothams which went right round inside to come out next to the two houses,(which were at the time lived in). Inbetween these two entrances where the offices of Naylors who made the Bifold miners safety lamps in workshops upstairs. On the right hand side of across from these, Halliwells ran a bottling/distribution depot. When they left Naylors moved across to occupy there building,and Sidebothams took over Naylors old works and eventually the two houses to occupy the whole of the left side of the WIEND. Back to the photo, left, with his hands on his knees was Roy Benjiman a linotype operator at the print works and the tall lad Tony worked at Naylors. Do you want more?

Yes Max; Where was Slow Joe`s?

"Slow Joes" -- There was no café actually in the Wiend.The only café nearby was in Millgate, the second shop having turned left out of the Wiend, next door to Mrs.Jolley's electrical shop.

Max, My friend Ken Earlam worked there about that time.

Ernest. When I mentioned the eating place, as a snack bar, it could well have been a small café. It was definitely on the corner of Millgate with the Weind/Wiend, as one turned into the Weind/Wiend, from Millgate, it was on the left hand side.

Albert; You say the cafe was on left hand side when entering the Wiend. Norman Cunliffe says it`s on left hand side when coming out of the Wiend.
I put slow joe`s wigan in Google and two websites are in `Stuff` in wiganworld:-
Memories, Millgate.
Memories, Some shops that no longer exist but people may remember, page 5.
Extract:-
Oppsosite the Boro chippy in Millgate used to be 'Slow Joe's' a small fish and chip restaurant. The meals were always superb but the wait always seemed like an eternity. As youngsters on the way home from the baths, if we opened the door to see anymore than half a dozen people sat waiting, our hearts would sink, but it was always worth the wait. Andy Jarvis, Basle, Switzerland

Ernest. Norman says it was on the right, and I say on the left. I can only re-picture it in my mind. I don't think the prisoner gave two hoots. He was just sorry he had,had his collar felt.

Norman Cunliffe has described were Slow Joes was, but in the time that I worked in the wiend it was known as the Devils Kitchen. Dave Marsh refers to cells found under the floors of Tom Whalleys just to the left of the Wiend photo (in Millgate). On very early maps and from what my grandfather told me this was once a police station. Harry C - I knew Ken and worked with him for a number of years, a nice bloke and good at his job. His brother Norman was in my class at school.

i cant get my head round this pik it doesnt look nowt like wiend to me it looks more like where wallpaper supplies is looking from library st ????

I'm positive too this is The Weind looking from Millgate, Tickles was just around the corner on the left, I used to go in with my mum and loved it!!

Anybody growing up in the 50's and sixties can tell this is the Weind! Especially if you lived in Scholes and went up town by the way of Millgate.

Definitely the wiend, I grew up round the corner in Millgate, there was a cafe run by the Ellison family , it was next door to Mrs Jolly electrical shop

Someone mentioned the cellar under Tom Whalley s in the Wiend, there was a Tunnel leading to the Parish church then down Under Hallgate to the rectory they are mentioned in the book’ The White Cockade passes.’ By Kathleen Fiddler