Does anyone have a subscription to 'findmypast' who would be willing to look something up for me? Familysearch has a George Donnell aged 17 in the 1861 census in Northill, Bedfordshire. I'd like to know who he was living with. In the 1881 census for Wigan, my great-grandfather (George O'Donnell) claims to have been born in Bedfordshire. I have never been able to find him and this may be a new lead. From his marriage certificate I know his father's name was John. Unfortunately, ancestry.co.uk does not show this George Donnell.

I would be really grateful.

LEP1950

If you need any other information - give me a shout


Household transcription 1861 census
Person: DONNELL, George
Address: Brookland, Northill
DONNELL, William Head Married M 42 1819 Agricultural Labourer Beeston Sandy, Bedfordshire
DONNELL, Ann Wife Married F 43 1818 Agricultural Labourer Wife Warden Northill, Bedfordshire
DONNELL, Maryann Daughter Unmarried F 21 1840 Plater Caldecote Northill, Bedfordshire
DONNELL, George Son Unmarried M 17 1844 Agricultural Labourer Beeston Sandy, Bedfordshire
DANNELL, Eliza Daughter Unmarried F 15 1846 Plater Beeston Sansy, Bedfordshire
DANNELL, Jane Daughter Unmarried F 12 1849 Plater Beeston Sansy, Bedfordshire
DANNELL, Sarah Daughter Unmarried F 6 1855 Scholar ..., Cambridgeshire

Thank you, Frances. Obviously I'll have to rule this George out. I have George's marriage certificate. He was a widower when he married and the father's name is given as John. I'm beginning to wonder if he was possibly registered as MacDonald. I found a George, son of John MacDonald in Bedfordshire. His mother's name was Elizabeth, his brother's Edward. Interestingly, "my" George had an Elizabeth and an Edward. OK, that's too little to assume anything, but do you think "MacDonald"/"O'Donnell" variations are possible???

Thanks again for looking. I really appreciate it.

LEP1950

Hi Frances,

How kind of you to help LEP1950, perhaps I could trouble you also? I would love to establish my Grandmothers fathers date of birth and location born. His name was - Fredrick Charles Ashton - my grandmothers name - Freda Lillian Ashton born in 1925 in Liverpool. She moved to North Harrow in Middlesex at the age of 5. Has two older sisters called Dorothy and Irene Ashton. I have no idea on the mothers name, a question currently left unanswered.

Should you happen to have the time to look, I would appreciate it.

Hello LEP1950

The name does appear to be one the scribes had a problem with for even on the 1861 census the same name has been spelled differently and I can imagine that the O could have been dropped from the surname quite easily but it is never safe to assume anything you need something to back things up - for it is so easy to get onto the wrong person - I will see if I can come up with anything today and if I do I will be in touch - but if you have any more information it may be helpful if you could let me know.

Hello barbarabanter

I do have some information for you - below is the marriage of Frederick Charles all the details you need to obtain the certificate are below should you agree this is the correct person.

England & Wales, Marriage Index: 1916-2005 about Frederick C Ashton
Name: Frederick C Ashton
Spouse Surname: Louise M Larking
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1918
Registration district: Hackney
Inferred County: Middlesex
Volume Number: 1b
Page Number: 581
Find Spouse: Find Spouse


I then did a search for Ashton births with the mothers maiden name as Larking and got these results

ASHTON Irene L England London, Hackney 1919
ASHTON Dorothy A England London, Hackney 1921
ASHTON Freda L England Lancashire, Liverpool 1925

I will look again today and see if I can find anymore information for you

Hello LEP1950 is this the 1881 census you spoke of

Household transcription 1881 census
Address:12, Brown Street, Wigan

O DONNELL, George Head Married M 48 1833 Plate Layer Bedford.
O DONNELL, Mary Wife Married F 30 1851 Rover Cotton MillCaran, Ireland.
O DONNELL, Edward Son Single M 4 1877 Wigan, Lancashire.
O DONNELL, Elizabeth Daughter Single F 0 1881 Wigan, Lancashire.
DOLAN, Annie Boarder Single F 30 1851 Rover Cotton MillWaterford, Ireland.
DORAN, David Lodger Head Married M 31 1850 General Labour Cotton Mill Wigan, Lancashire.
DORAN, Catherine Wife Married F 30 1851 Rover Cotton MillWaterford, Ireland.
MC MAHON, Mary Lodger Head Married F 37 1844 Rover Cotton Mill Meath, Devon, Ireland.
MC MAHON, Catherine Daughter Single F 15 1866 Cotton WeaverMonaghan, Ireland.

Hello barbarabanter

I have found a couple of people on Ancestry with the same family members - I will be in touch later

Hi Frances,
You are multitasking!! Thank you for taking the trouble to help. Yes that is the 1881 census I meant. George and Mary went on to have two more children - George (my grandfather) and Lucy. They were married at St Thomas, Wigan in 1876. George's father is listed as John O'Donnell (deceased). George was a widower (I know nothing about this) and Mary nee Rielly a 25 year old spinster. Her father's name was Simon and he was apparently still alive, but I've also never found him. George died in 1885 supposedly aged 44. Mary remarried. Although O'Donnell sounds very Catholic, George was actually CofE. There are only two CofE O'Donnells in the burial records. My mother would have been surprised had she known this!! Mary and the children were Catholics.
I can't understand why I can't find him if he was born in Bedfordshire. Where is he in 1851, 1861 and 1871?? As I said, his father's name was John, his mother's possibly Elizabeth. I have thought of Donnell, Donald, Donnelly but no luck. MacDonald does seem a bit far-fetched, but I'm wondering....

Incidentally, The young Dorans lodging with them are also related to me but through a totally different line, through my paternal grandmother's ancestors. Small world.

Thanks again,
LEP1950

Hi again Frances,
I've just taken a walk through the 1871 census for the Wallgate area George and Mary were living in in 1876 (Lyon Street) and where their descendants later lived (Brown Street, Clayton Street etc) but they were not there in 1871. It's not unusual not to be able to find someone in one census but in three?? Where on earth was he? I'd appreciate any idea.
LEP1950

LEP1950 - This could be the 4 births mothers maiden name Riley

ODONNELL Edward Joseph RILEY 1877 Wigan Wigan & Leigh Lancashire WIG/120/303

O'DONNELL Elizabeth RILEY 1880 Wigan Wigan & Leigh Lancashire WIG/134/212

O'DONALD Mary Lucy RILEY 1882 Wigan Wigan & Leigh Lancashire WIG/142/291

O'DONNELL George RILEY 1885 Wigan Wigan & Leigh Lancashire WIG/154/87

Frances

Thanks, Frances, but I know this. It's the history I can't find anything about. It did take me a while to find Lucy. She died in 1892 and in the 1891 census, she is listed (or transcribed as Obonell).
She appears to have been disabled and was in the workhouse. Very, very sad.

Hello LEP1950

It was the spelling of the surname I was interested in, there was a variation with Mary Lucy's name.

Hello Frances,
It's frustrating with these variations. The mother's name is RIELLY on the marriage certificate, but she could be in previous censuses as RILEY, RIELLY, REILLY or O'Riley etc. I've been trying for a few years to get further back with this couple. I even wondered whether Bedfordshire was meant or whether George was born in Bedford, Leigh, but no luck there either. Then I looked for a place in Ireland that sounded like Bedford - Beaufort or something like that. There actually is - in Kerry, but it would be strange for the enumerator to list that Mary was born in Ireland and not to do so for George. I had hoped the "George Donnell" was a new lead, but obviously this is not the case.

If you have any other ideas, I'd be glad, but don't spend hours on the problem. I've spent years!!

Thanks again,
LEP1950

Hello LEP1950

I am not having much luck with George at all but I will keep looking and if I do come up with anything I will let you know. You seem to have had a really good go at finding the family - Goos luck

Hi LEP1950 and Frances, thank you for your help to date.

Should you happen to have the time, are you able to answer the following ( huge thank you in advance !!! )

Louise Maria Larking / Born in 1896 ( which month ? )
Died 1936 in which county?
Place of birth : Middlesex, England
Husband : Frederick Charles Ashton
Married in 1918 - whereabouts? Which church?
Address in 1911 -
230 South Lambeth Road, Vauxhall, South Lambeth, London

where did they move to next?

Information from Ancestry

They married in Hackney Middlesex the information you need to get the marriage cert is above - I will see if I can find out any more


Louisa Maria Larking
Birth 18 Sep 1895 in Stepney, London
Death 08 Feb 1986 in Hatch End, Harrow, Middx

Dorothy Adelaide ASHTON
Birth 01 Oct 1921 in 33 Dalston Lane, Hackney, London
Death 25 Jan 2005 in 38 Lordsfield Gardens, Overton, Hampshire

Irene Louisa Ashton
Birth 22 Jan 1919 in 33 Dalston Lane, Hackney, London
Death 31 Aug 2004 in Metlifecare, Coastal Villas, Paraparaumu, New Zealand

Frederick Charles Ashton
Birth 12 Jan 1893 in Stepney, London
Death 06 Aug 1988 in North Harrow

14 Apr 1918
Louise M Larking Age: 22 Marriage to Frederick Charles Ashton at St Barnabas, Dalston, North London

Frances - HUGE thank you - really appreciate you taking the time to look

Do I dare ask I am trying to find out about my Grandad

Jack Thomas RADFORD was born on 10th May 1918

He died on 20th June 1995 in Frinton, Essex

At this point in time I have no idea as to where he was born and who his parents were. Name - DOB - residence - Died

Should you have the time to help?

This was the only Jack Thomas to come up so this could be him

Name: RADFORD, Jack T
Registration district: West Ham
County: Essex
Year of registration: 1918
Quarter of registration: Apr-May-Jun
Mother's maiden name: Winbolt
Volume no:4A
Page no:672

Is this the parents of Jack Thomas

Godfrey T Radford married Ann Winbolt
Name: RADFORD, Godfrey T
Registration district: West Ham
County: Essex
Year of registration: 1916
Quarter of registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
Spouse's last name Winbolt
Volume no: 4A
Page no: 159

Frances any chance I can ask one more questin, you really have been helpful!

Ann Winbolt DOB : ?
Born in Camberwell, London ?
Died when and where ?

Godfrey T Radford DOB : ?
Born :

Son Jack Thomas Radford
Died when and where ? in the war I think...

This appears to be the school record of Godfrey from Ancestry will see if I can find anything else there

London, England, School Admissions and Discharges, 1840-1911 about Godfrey Radford
Name: Godfrey Radford
Age: 9
Birth Date: 15 Nov 1886
School: St Leonard's Road School
Borough: Tower Hamlets
Admission Date: 13 Jan 1896
Parent: Godfrey Radford
Notes: Saint Leonard's Road School (0641) opened in 1885
Reference Number: LCC/EO/DIV05/STLEO/AD/001

The death of Godfrey

RADFORD, GODFREY THOMAS
Rank:Private
Service No:41045
Date of Death:17/04/1918
Age:30
Regiment/Service:King's Own Scottish Borderers 2nd Bn. Panel ReferencePanel 5.MemorialPLOEGSTEERT MEMORIAL
Additional Information:

Husband of Ann Radford, of 31, May Rd., Lowestoft.

Death of Jack Thomas

Civil registration event: Death
Name: RADFORD, Jack Thomas
Registration district: Colchester
County: Essex
Year of registration: 1995
Month of registration: June
Date of Birth:10 May 1918
District no: 4691A
Reg no: A64C
Ent no: 091
DOR: 695


Date of death re Ancestry: Death: 20 Jun 1995 - Frinton, Essex

Ann Winbolt - exact DOB not known

Ann Winbolt
Birth 1887
Death Sep 1937 in Essex South Western, Essex, England

Huge thank you - you are obviously a fully paid member of Ancestry... thank you

Hi Frances,
Thank you again for all your help, I have been able to track down a website and successfully found my great grandfathers details ( website link seen below ) would you happen to know if I can get free access somewhere else?

Rank:Private
Service No:41045
Died :17/04/1918 aged 30
Regiment/Service : King's Own Scottish Borderers 2nd Bn. Panel ReferencePanel 5.MemorialPLOEGSTEERT MEMORIAL


https://www.forces-war-records.co.uk/NameSearch?FirstNamePlaceholderText=First%20name&FirstName=Godfrey&FirstNameIncludeSimilar=False&SurnameIncludeSimilar=False&SaveThisSearch=False&RecordDateStartYear=1700&RecordDateEndYear=2012&IncludeRecordsWithoutServiceNumber=True&DiedInActiveService=False&SurvivedActiveService=False&ReceivedGallantryAward=False&MentionedInDespatches=False&RecordType=NotSelected&Page=0&RecordsPerPage=0&SurnameNamePlaceholderText=Surname&Surname=Radford