STUBSHAW CROSS

I`ve finally decided to get down to writing a book about the full history of my village of Stubshaw Cross ...It starts in the 17th. century but of interest to most people still alive will be the growth and changes made in the 20th century so I am appealing for help in compiling and recording these changes .. I know that many people left in the fifties to live at Bryn and Landgate so if you can provide old photos or write a story about your family who lived here please get cracking...material can safely be left at the ainscough`s newsagents on Bolton Rd. at Stubshie ... Tim and Kath are good friends of mine. Also ,of course ,we still have many old stubshiers living here and they will be asked to contribute as well. the more the merrier......Ray Davies

Have a word with owd Tommy , Ray, he is 91, Just cant think of his surname.

its Tommy Woodward you mean...Tommy is a good friend of mine..known him all my life .and he`s only 91 next july he`ll have you know,, and yes Tommy has given me some good information already and will continue to do so ... there will be a special write up on him in the book... He told me today that he`s just got his new driving licence until 2012 and not even a medical check needed... amazing lad!!!

Hi Rayon I was talking to Tommy in Morrisons this afternoon
(Thursday) he was telling me about his driving licence, not bad for a 91 year old eh.

Ray when Tommy as told you everything that went on in Stubahaw Cross in the early 40s and maybe before there wont be much for the likes of me to mention.

A full history of Stubshaw Cross eh.?

I'll bet it'll fit on one A4 sheet.

I recall local historian Walter Carney saying a while back that he thought Ashton Town Centre had been sinking over the years, because of subsidence.

He used as evidence old and new photos taken from Stupshie, saying that it was now higher than it used to be, relative to Ashton centre.

But..my own thought is that Ram broo is actually not as steep as it was in the 50s and 60s. Do any of the Stupshie folks have an opinion on that? Or is my inclination wrong (geddit)?

As you know (or should know), land is constantly moving. Surveyors keep records to monitor how much and how fast. When you see them with their theodolites at the side of the road, that's what they're doing.

Mind you, it's not surprising that you wouldn't know that, writing things like 'Stupshie' instead of it's correct name.

Tonker..I`m sure you don`t really mean to be sarcastic about my beloved village but you may like to know that the first six A4 pages didn`t even get me past the 17th. century.and when I eventually get to the last hundred years which will be the recollections of people still alive then I`m sure that will take a couple of hundred pages given the format I am using....And as for your making fun of the word `stupshie` that is exactly how most of us pronounce it i.e. its simply a slang word....as your so clever perhaps you can tell us all exactly what the word `stubshaw ` means...Jackdog.Ram`s Head brow is not as steep as it was when I was a lad because I can climb it easier now at 72 than I could when I was 10( mind you I was usually carrying an `accy` then, lol)

Stupshie is what we call it. Those of us who come from where I come from. Proper Ashtonians, I mean. We also know when to use its and when to use it's.

Anyway, you didn't answer the question. Is the hill steeper now than it was, or less steep?

Also how do you know what surveyors are doing when I see them with their theodolites at the side of the road? The last ones I saw said they were definitely not keeping records to monitor how much and how fast the land was moving.

Try to be more precise, please. Wildly inaccurate statements help no-one.

Thanks Rayonline, I thought I couldn't have got fitter over the years either. Coming down it at full pelt on our bikes was quite an experience in the 50s and 60s.
Speaking of oldsters who might be able to help with info, there is another Tommy I know, who used to live on the corner of Bryn Road and Bolton Road -- so really Gillacre, not Stupshie -- but he was born in 1917 and has a superb memory for people and incidents of the past. He lives in Warrington now, but will be interested in your book when you get to the 20th century part.

Just stand near to were the rams head pub used to be and look over Ashton to St Oswolds church steeple thats the best way to see iff Ashton is sinking or not, when I used to stand their and wait for the bus to Golborne in the 50s you could just see St Oswolds steeple that will tell you iff Ashtons sinking or not.

Good luck with book Rayon

Rayon, just a thought, but would it not be better to start with the 20th history now?

I have not lived in "stubshie" nearly 60 years but i still call it that.

Trixie, everybody who is anybody calls it that.

Which makes that Tonker chappie a bit of a nobody...!

The only thing I wasn't sure of was how to spell it...Stupshie, Stupshy, Stupshi, or what?

Jackdog is that Tommy/Tom B -- that your on about if so he lives across the road from me in Ashton,was telling him about the book that Raymond is writing,he was talking about the old place he came to live Cross from me in 1985 if it's the same man, he is very well educated and as you say with a superb memery of people and the area

Dougie,
Nope that's not him. I don't want to put his name on here without asking first but it is an unusual name beginning with H. and he lives in Warrington now.

Dougie...A Tom Brooks used to live across from the paper shop on Bolton Rd. If its him can you ask him for his memories? Also Veteran and Trixie... I know you are old stupshiers and you can also contribute to the book by writing down your memories and histories especially info on your parents and grandparents. I want this book to be about the people ,by the people, and not just me.. and incidently, I f this book does eventually get published I want any profits to go towards the future upkeep of the heritage garden which will belong to our community and will hopefully bring pride to our village. To Uncle Joe....You are right of course and there is nothing to stop people sending in their 20th century contributions now even though I am still in the 17th. century...The important thing is to write it down now so that its on record. thanks everybody for the interest up to now....

Hi ray i will help all i can,

thanks trixie, keep me informed as to your progress. me and some friends had a go at counting how many shops were here up to 1960ish and we got up to 20,could be more, today only two left not counting the estate shops.Asda has got a lot to answer for...

Did you count jinny mac's pie makin as a shop?

she made delicious pies in her home and we used to queue up the hallway for them.

memories...

Trixie.. No I didn`t count jinny mac`s pies because I wasn`t aware of .. which house was it?.... No,don`t tell me!!!! because that`s the very reason I want the book written in the first place because we all have our own memories and if I can get them all together in one place I think a lot of prople will be surprised and interested in just what our village was about( no spicy stuff , mind you!)and we have to leave some stuff in the book to entice people to buy it,, don`t you agree? I am also mindful of copy rights and privacy rights as well...

I also remember being 3 years old +having to have a sleep on a camp bed at school.

Yes i agree.i would love a copy .

I'll have to pick my mam's brains when i see her next.
My auntie had to stay at home from school to look after the house etc,you could'nt do that now.

I remember we used to go in a gang with babies +young kids +prams for picnics up to the harrow pub with jam butties and wait for somebody to go in the pub and get us pop+crisps.
All this was in the lovely summer holidays.

Used to be a baby sitter that baby sat in someones house and mind loads of kids on a saturday night. I wont give names. I found a photo of myself about 3 years old on a float with others from stubshie at a carnival if it's any use.
I also remember mr bentham the knocker upper.
My dad also kept pigeons.
Going down bolton road to take the wireless battery to be charged.

I hope you can use some of his information.

Its not "STUPSHIE" its "STUBSHIE" well it was said like that in the 40s un 50s when i lived there

"STUBSHIE"

stubashaw cross veteran???

Sithee yotwo.. that Tonker`s gerrin us feytin amungst ussells nay LOL!
On a more serious note. I`v just taken about twenty pictures around Stub/Stup/shie of all the sections where changes have occured since 1950`s . now I want old pictures to compare on the then and now section of the book.I can if I have to resort to drawings but I am crap at drawings so is anyone out there good at drawing houses...
Also I keep going up to old women and asking them to see if they can find anything old in their drawers....Am I on dangerous ground there or what? I mean ,how would you put it? Answers on the back of an old postcard please...

Trixie did your dad keep pigeons on the pens that were on the street opposite the old labour club can't remember its name, because i remember when I was about 13/14 taking boxes with pigeons and letting them out when I got on riding lane were we called top place used to enjoy doing that.

Yes ,there is bungalows built on there now...I think.

Of north street.

Trixie tell you a story about pigeons.

My dad used to live near to the jam bridge in Golborne and they kept a few pigeons, they had one called "Smokey" it was a bellter always came home. A bloke in the same terreced houses kept them as and always said that he's was better than my grandads, so on this very foggy day my grandad sent my dad out with a pigeon in a box and the bloke asked him was it smokey and they said yes, well he must have thought if he's will come back mine should, so of he went the same way as my dad,passed my dad on the way back
The old pigeon never came back because there was no pigeon in dads box. so the following day this here bloke asked my grandad had smokey come home and he said yes, well the bloke said mine has'nt and my grandad said hard lines.

true story that

HaHa.I used to breed birds,parrots etc.I also had white doves,I sold some once to a man and told him strictly to keep them locked in for a while to lose there homing instinct,His son came round soon after and asked if his dads birds had come back as he had accidently let them out,I said if you recognise them catch them again.tough.

Although in the Forties I didnt live at Stubshaw Cross,I was at school in the same class as Malcolm Cowley whose parents kept the chip shop at "Stubshie"

Cowleys chippy his father was a bit of army type bloke you had to be quite when you went for anything, he could have done with that minor bird that dysons had at a chippy in Leigh Street Golborne he would have thrown it out straight away

come on you old stubshiers ..Inow have 19 NOW pictures of the village in the book and as yet only 3 old matching ones.dig um eyt will yu.I am also contemplated doing a video now with me walking round doing a full visual picture o0f the entire history so is there anyone out there who can provide the equipment and be my cameraman? I`m so deep into this thing now,I`m driving my wife nuts!!! but its gerrin exciting.... oooooh the stories I`m hearing from the old fogies....

Ohhhh i'm gerrin exited now waitin for it.
Where will we be able to buy it.

Lookin forward to the video
will it be on dvd.?

Ray did anybody remember that woman at top of north street that collected potato peelings for sum pigs in exchange for an orange?

Trixie.. this book will be out before 2012 at the rate I`m going ..I find people love talking about the`good old days` but can I get them to write it down? can I nellie....Now that`s an old saying ..The video will be a DVD and that shouldn`t take as long but that can`t be started until the garden is finished. they are cracking on with it now ..after five days they are down to the foundations and you can see the pipe from the old gents toilet exposed,,, Potato peelings!!!Remember saving them but never knew why but I always wondered where that orange came from in my christmas stocking... I will ask people.....Thanks for the photo..it was Annie....

Hi ray I remember the old airade shelters at the bottom of north street an` playin`in um when we wer` kidsan` the bonfires we had on the croft across from were you lived just behind thamos's. the shelters at the end of the gardens across from your house that was the first time i tried a cig an`never had one since.

Do you want us to print everything on here about those days I hope not might get in trouble wit law
[:D

Veteran. Don`t give away ALL our little secrets mate LOL
especially what went on in that shelter!!!
Like I said to Trixie ger it written deawn and then we`ll look at it together re suitability....And make sure you get down to our heritage garden when its finished. I`ll keep you informed on its progress...

Gerrit it written daen i've forgot already..i thought you'd done it..

What's this abaat gardins+toilits,
Have a misst summat?

You'll haft send im e mails like me veteran.
You can gerrit of photos

I haven't seen you on St.Helens Chat site for a while, Rayonline!

Don`t change the subject Tonker. I`m still waiting for you to tell me where the name Stubshaw came from???

I don't know, Miss. I've never claimed to know, Miss. It was Him, Miss!


On a serious note, though, I do notice a place called Stubshaw's on the map presented before me. Taking this observance into account, I would hold that Stubshaw was the name of a farming landholder managing one of the tithes of Ashton.
The crossing of two roads, or tracks as the case may have been in those days, in close proximity to the said 'Stubshaw's' residence and within the aforementioned 'tithe', does suggest that this 'crossing' enjoyed the title of 'Stubshaw's Cross' in the immediate locality.

I put it to my learned friend, rayonline, that this could be the true story?

Do I win threppence for being close?

Did you spell that right mester?


threepence?

Would you say 'threepence', or 'threppence', missis? (in old money, I mean)


PS ... Rayonline's probably rooting around St.Helens Chat site, as we speak, trying to find out if he's entitled to any legacies left over from the Greenalls brewing fortune!

thripence mester.

Threppence, Thrippence or Thruppence. I've won it! It's mine! Get your hands off!

i've gorra tin full.

Sorry Tonker..You don`t even win a groat....And as I have said before... Buy the book...And as for my ancestral rights you don`t know how near I was to becoming the next Lord Greenall... but that`s another story!!!
Trixie !!! surprise! surprise!! I have a tinfull as well.What did we save um for?

Trixie Wan't it said like this" THRIPUNCE"

It was deawn bouwton road were ah lived

When av thought er somit else al send email`t rays ok

exuse my "stubshie" bin away to long.
i lived dawn theer too
did tha know dereck livesy?


ye thats wat i did.

If you go down Bryn Gates Lane there are a row of terraced houses and a large house which I think is Bryn Hall, these are in the middle of farm fields between Stubshaw Cross and Bryn, in the garden of the large house there is or there was a very large ancient stone cross. Does anyone have any information on this please. Thanks.

Veteran. I know we`re deviating a bit but I always find its harder to actually spell out the dialect words than it is to say it....but say thripnce quick and its as near as dammitwhatever,Tonker still doesn`t get any money ,cos he was wrong......

WOOOOPEE.

we won one.


abut we'll be able read wat it sez....

Rayon I suppose its whatever way you say it it sounds the same anyway so why bother eh.

Tonkers wrong that makes a change, don't be supprised if he's not back he'll be looking in all the dialect books there is. I just think he's a bad looser

Never mind 'Tonker's wrong'! To prove me wrong, you have to declare what's RIGHT, and I don't think you can?

The question from Rayonline was, '... where the name Stubshaw came from'???
I've seen a map of Ashton with a farm marked on it as 'Stubshaws'. That was before the area was marked as 'Stubshaw Cross'.

Nothing to do with 'dialect'.

Tonker. there was never a farm called `Stubshaws` but the poor fields were called the two stubshaws if that`s any help. the farm built on the poor fields was called charity farm .farmers name in 1841 was Henry Wood(Harry) and as a clue the name described the area and not anybody`s names.I can assure you that I do know the answer but you may have to buy the book....c`mon don`t be mean...place an order!!!

And the dialect thing was a seperate argument about how you spell stupshie/stubshie etc,

Just been reading `Borough Life` about theplanned core strategy. and I was horrified to see what they are proposing for Stubshaw Cross.. A massive new High School just behind the Heritage Garden and the go-ahead of the industrial expansion that we fought off before.This will bury our village under an avalanche of cars,lorries,yellow buses and hordes of screaming,destructive schoolkids . we just can`t let this happen!! we have got to re-organise a massive protest NOW...Why do the councillors of Wigan Metro hate Stubshie so much?

Just wanted to add that on my walks through around Stubshie I have spoken to a few people about places/ people from the past and I found that Mary from Lily Lane Farm really informative. Could I aso mention that if any group is formed I would put my name down to help in any way.

Debs2. I know your Mum is an old Stubshier(Whoops, not THAT old).And I would love to know what Mary saidabout the Plans given that her and their Joe stood to gain from it all .We haven`t spoken since the last campaign.. And it seems that the Mad commitee are starting up again which rules me out of any involvement given what they did last time. I`ll just make my own protest in my own way!!

I thought Lily Farm was up for sale, with permission for six houses to be built on it?

I might well be up for sale because Joe doesn`t work the land anymore, He`s too owd....And as for permission to build six houses,does that include knocking down the old farmhouse built in 1740? It should be a listed building.
And how come nobody in Stupshie knows its for sale ? Do you work for MI5 Tonker?

I never thought that I would hear "Stubshie " called a village.There were some real'characters " living there. I
remember a Lennie Simm a big fellow who used to go into the
King's Arms in Ashton among other pubs.Lennie had a hole in
one knee of his pants and the then landlady Mrs. Vernon said
" Lennie , haven't you got a good suit'. Lennie replied " Yes
Mrs , but I daren't put it on or these Buggers will think I've
been paid up".

Hi Rayonline555 Yes Pat is my Mum, I did mention that I had been talking to you last year. I was thinking about talking to Mary with regard people that she has know over the years. I did ask her about the farm and she said that it was nearly sold to a builder but the deal fell through at the last min due to the state of the building market, she felt that it wouldn't sell due to the price asked and what the purchaser would be required to do. I wonder if the owners are now keeping hold of it because they know something else is in the offing?

Debbie. I have been reading your postings on the Ashton Community Forum but as I don`t actually post on that site due to past dissagreements with the Admin. I couldn`t add my comments...Its nice to see your passion for the well being of our village and I hope your allowed to play an active part in any campaign , However,I think that this time the battle will be in vain....The argument in favour of a new school with all the added community benefits such as a swimming pool,gym facilities,a community centre etc. is such a strong one that it will be Stubshaw Cross against the rest.I therefore won`t be having any input to the campaign as the organisers are as before.. And twice bitten,third time shy...

Hi Ray, I was sorry to read that you wouldn't be getting involved in the campaign as I do know that you equally are as passionate about the area as many others. I wasn't aware of any dispute.
I do strongly believe that this would be another moster in the making and once again it is the towns people who will suffer. The new 'super school' is a new one to me and I am going to look into it more. I am not sure how long the funding will last, but if it is anything like the NHS funding, it seems to dry up very quickly. After talking to someone they explained that the 'Old Grammar' on Warrington Road has not that many pupils going in this year as they are building one of these super schools in Haydock it seemed to make it a little clearer then the reason for it, but that situation could just be short term? Like I say I need to find out more but as we know 'big' is not always the best, and we always go full circle again, ie. cottage hospitals and smaller shops. Then the site position is not good, it is a bottle neck along there anyway. I think that it isn't a done deal yet, and people are not just going to take this at face value, if it can be proved that it will make the traffic situation much worse...then who knows???

So where did Stubshaw Cross get its name?

Only Ray seems to know, and he won't tell us so that we have to buy his book to find out!

Came across Wood Henry, Poor Ground Farm, Stubshaw Cross Farmer and income tax callector,
looking at this I would say that Poor Ground Farm was classed as in the hamlet of Edge Green in the town of Ashton at one time,(could be way off it )

ayrefield, the cross in the garden of Bryn Hall is said to be the site of the old chapel.

Dougie.How on earth did you come to that conclusion? Every old bugger in Stubshie knows that Harry Woods Lane was named after Henry(Harry)Wood its now just Wood Lane situated at the corner where the heritage garden is and leading up to Tommy Bartons Farms. The poor ground was The Two Stubshaws and still is according to Land Registry and the charity farm was on the corner of the poor ground.in the 1841 census he stated that he lived at Stubshaw Cross as did the residents of the other houses situated in Woods Lane. What may be confusing you is that there are other poor fields up Golborne Rd. starting with the farm known as Charity Farm next to the new estate. like the Stubshaw fields the Golborne Rd. fields are still owned by `The Poor of Ashton` and administered by the Linen and Woollen Charity who are in fact wrongly claiming ownership.Unless somebody stops them that is....

Ray just let it pass as me being wrong but this was coped from it Wood Henry, Poor Ground Farm, Stubshaw Cross Farmer and income tax callector,there was on mention of Stubshie as being in Ashton but Edge Green was

Ray, I've no doubt that you'll have seen -These-.
These accounts prove that the land was purchased by the 'Ashton Stock Charities' (which still exists in the form of the 'Ashton Linen and Woollen Stock Charity') with money donated to the cause and has been administered by them since.
In law, the land belongs to them, on behalf of the residents of the 'Ancient Township of Ashton in Makerfield'.

Yes Tonker, I have seen those accounts of the so called `purchase` and like you I, at first,took it as read that they indeed were the rightful owners , however. I pursued the matter further and I discovered that what they actually purchased in 1720 was the re-lease from the incumbent farmer at that time ... what niggled at me was how can anybody buy land that had been given to the poor? who do they buy it from? and how come they couldt produce any deeds of purchase? I finally discovered the absolute truth only a few weeks ago in Lancashire Records office ... However,the charity registered the land in 2004 citing the fact that they have collected rent from it since 1720 and offering no other documents, If noone challenges that registration before 2016 then they will then,and only then become lawful owners.I can lead a community challenge which will cost money and I can`t afford to do it on my own ... That`s one reason why I fell out with the residents group and MAD because they didn`t beleive me . At the moment I am not prepared to reveal my absolute proof until I can get more people to support me...Its a lonely furrow I`v been ploughing this last three years...

Ray - I've got a good bank of photos building up as the Heritage Garden progresses. You're more than welcome to a copy.

Well done ray.good luck.

Keep goin withhead dawn.

Thanks for your offer Dave and I would be glad of any help you can give me. Please contact me by e-mail or phone (I`m in the book) if you like, and we can meet up...

Dougie....Only just looked at your blog. The guy next to you on the photo Ralph Yates was in my class at central schoolHe had a lovely head of hair ...once....but don`t tell him I said that..LOL...And I know he`s on the Net cos we made contact a while back so if you do see this Ralph you still look younger than me if that`s a consolation...

Ray I did know we have talked about you we are in the Bowling Club every Sunday night if you ever feel like popping in,

if Rayonline5555 has "absolute proof" that the charity dont own the land, then surely this should be public knowledge? Like Tonker pointed out . it is set in the stone tablets that the charity purchased the land in 1720. If Rayonline can despute these stone tablets then surely it would put an end to all arguments?

Put it on here Ray then you will get support. No point taking it to the grave.

dear ned, Why should I confide in complete strangers and trust you to support me when I have twice been let down by people I called my friends?

Suit yerself.

Just so others on here know the truth, I will say this regarding the two times you speak about your so-called friends letting you down.

1. MAD committee decided to have the Chair submit the petition to our MP.

2. Not one person(I repeat, NOT ONE) voted for you to be Project Manager of the Heritage Garden. One abstained.

Both decisions followed constitutions democratically.

If you had EVER and I mean EVER revealed any evidence or sources for your claims, then maybe someone might take you seriously. Sadly you have not.

You have been claiming that you can prove that the Charity do not own the land for the last 3 years , yet earlier on in this thread you state that only 4 weeks ago you have found the truth.

I wish you well in writing a book about Stubshaw Cross but if provide no evidence or sources then it will be worthless.

BTW you are no good at anagrams.

Ray don't keep on arguing with these men just tell them the truth wether Stubshaw cross is Stubshaw cross or not what ever your all going on about does it matter really or is it just one person thinking he knows more than the other?? as you know I'm an old stubshier and i'm getting fed up with all this stuff. Why don't you and Tonker go and look at records together then you can both say which is right then.

for Gods sake.

This is rayonline5555 thread if you look at his first post he was only asking for help off the people that lived at Stubshaw Cross, with his book to record the growth and changes made in the 20th century,he made the mistake of answering people back about the history of the place witch he already had

dear ned, re. your comment that just so that others on here should know the truth? Do you REALLY want people to know the truth about you? Do you really think that people on my thread care about what you think ?
AS dougie so rightly says I started this thread to gather around me people who care about Stubshaw Cross and its history. And I will not entertain negative idiots like you who wouldn`t know the truth if it smacks you in the eye.
So I will not reply to your untruths and I will reveal all in my time ,not yours, so don`t bother coming on to this thread again unless its to apologise...As for your childish attempt to hide behind silly anagrams try being a man and tell everybody what your real name is as I do. Or would you rather I told them. And as for wishing me well with my book., I don`t believe you!!

Rayonline said
"Do you REALLY want people to know the truth about you? Do you really think that people on my thread care about what you think ? "

Yes and Yes.

So lets hear it.

As for my untruths, have I told any lies? point them out please.

In answer to Dougie;

Dougie said:
" his book to record the growth and changes made in the 20th century"

Sorry Dougie but Ray said:
"you may like to know that the first six A4 pages didn`t even get me past the 17th. century"

Sorry Dougie but Ray said:
"you may like to know that the first six A4 pages didn`t even get me past the 17th. century"

that wasn't in his first post was it

Dougie,Please don`t waste your time with him... I know him well and believe me ,he isn`t worth it.

Been reading through your topic again I can see that you have been out taking photo's of the area,and asking for old photo's to match with them you should upload them like this so that people hopefully can find a match for you (you never know)Click photo

Thanks for that,Dougie .You take some great photos.The only problem with is that if I put up all the photos and somebody comes on and matches them up with old replicas a lot of the dramatic impact is taken away from the book before its published and sales might suffer. I would have to ask people to pass them direct to me and not show them on the net....Still, I`ll think about it. the other alternative is to get a good graphic artist to do drawings from my memory ...

Some nice shots there dougie. A good record of the road.

Stubshaw Cross History Group has a repository for old photographs, why not try them?

Here is the email address of their secretary:

butz65@blueyonder.co.uk

If there is a Stubshaw Cross History Group then it must be a secret society ,.. secret from me that is..So i can only assume they don`t want me to be a member and therefore I would certainly not give them the chance to refuse to help me. but thanks for trying.///Now,where have I seen that e-mail address before?

Secret??? You were asked to join the group!! maybe you should start researching your own memory.

As I recall you didnt have much interest in joining the team. Not suprised really cos you cant work with anyone else and dont want to share anything.

We have a community to build, and it involves everyone. Dont stand in the way, and dont be left out.

dear ned I`m getting really tired of your efforts to sully my reputation,,,,I just wish you would get out of my life and try harder to find something interesting to do in yours..If you had ever asked me to join anything I`d have died of shock!! If this history group of yours actually exists then prove it and maybe I can teach you a few lessons (for a price) And for your information I am a member of the Wigan History Society. We meet at the Caledonian every month. Come along, you might learn how decent people get along together
`We have a community to build` ? So why don`t you build it properly and not distort our history to suit yourselves?
There is already two major mistakes on the garden and its not half built yet...Found out where the word Stubshaw comes from yet? Its not that hard to find ,you know..

Could you advise me as to when the next meeting is please?

We are closed for summer ..next meeting in September.. Go onto WW home page and click on to Wigan History Society.. you`ll get all the information you want on there.

Then I shall get myself a tan, and collate my information and sources and look forward to seeing you there.

Hi Ray, nice speaking to you the other night. Just seen your posting about the Historical society, did you say that it meets in the Calidonian on Bolton Road?

Hi Debs

Meetings are held at the Caledonian Hotel on Bolton Road, Ashton-in-Makerfield, Near Wigan, WN4 8PF on the third Monday of each month (7.30 for 8.00pm). No meetings are held in July and August. Tel 01942 727875. Mine Hosts Paula and Allan.

Note that meetings for October and November will be on the third Tuesday only as they are being held at Wigan History Shop in Library Street. Tel 01942 828128.

Forget that last bit Debbie. The History shop won`t reopen until at least Jan. 2010. as it stands the next meeting is at the Cally in Sept.2009 an update will show on the website nearer the time....That info I gave you and Kay about the Tithe map.....I1m thinking of confronting the Charity trustees about it...What do you think?

Ray I know this going of your book but is it possible that you could find outfor me if the new Stubshaw Cross boys club is still going, I've put 3 threads on asking and don't get any answers I've even emailed the person that used to put a thread on WW about it but got no answer from him.

Hi Ray

Sorry, getting ready to go on my jollies and only just seen your posting. Have you got all your facts ready? Do you need any support? I think that once you have it all in place I would request a meeting.
See you in a week!

Sorry veteran, I don`t know of any boys club except for the football club in edge green st.and I presume that`s just for football....

Ray yes the boys club started at the Edge green street ground about 4/5 months ago and every time the club had the get together a certain person would put a thread on w/w to let us know how it was going, but nothing been on for a few months now and I just thought you might have heard about it.

Thats were we played in the 50s as Stubshaw Cross Boys club,
when stubshaw had an amateur football team.
I will have to send an email to the fella who used to put the thread on.

Hi Veteran,

Yes the youth club is still up and running and great things came from it. They now have their own committee ( Stubshaw Cross Youth Committee) and organised a fun-day last saturday for all the community. Part of the fun-day was a lads against dads football match. We beat them 6-5, it was a good match and a great day.

As for Stubshaw Cross Boys; there is a pic on WW. Are you on it? paste the link.

http://www.wiganworld.co.uk/album/photo.php?opt=7&id=7468&gallery=Stubshaw+Cross+Boys+Football+Team&offset=0

Hi Ray. Re your posts about Stubshaw Cross,I was born next door to the Methodists Church at Rams Head, and lived in the Ashton area until I moved to Leicestershire some 30 years ago. and hadn't been on the WW site for many years. I see you are writing a book about STUPSHIE as I have alwasy called it, and will buy one when it's available. If I can find any old 'photos I will send them to you, I have your e.mail address from the e.mails Gordon Green sends us both.
VETERAN Mentions Stubshaw Cross Boys Club, I was a member in the very early 50s when it was run by Frank Powell who had the shop in Bolton Road

rayonline
I seem to remember Arthur Withington as the manager of Stubshaw Cross Boys FC in the late 50s,also Ossie Wright used to do some training with the team.Is Ossie still alive and living in Stubshaw Cross.

Yes, Ossie is still with us. I see him quite regular going into the paper shop but I think he`s given up on training these days Lol......Talking of Frank Powell ,he sadly, passed away earlier this year, I am assuming you mean Frank Junior because of course Frank Senior was married to Rhoda Darbyshire,old Jimmy`s Daughter and they ran the shop when Jimmy died..... As for the book I was writing,I`m afraid I`ve shelved it for the moment because I disagree with so many things about the garden that I would just find myself critising it in the book wheras all I wanted to to do was to tell the truth as near as possible based on my research....I am so very disappointed at the way things have turned out .....